Happy Birthday To Me (1981)

Episode 484, 2 Guys and a Chainsaw Horror Movie Review Podcast

Todd: Hello, and welcome to another episode of Two Guys and a Chainsaw. I’m Todd. 

Craig: And I’m Craig. 

Todd: This week we are doing a listener request. You know on our website there is option for you to talk to us. You just click that link, and you’ll instantly go to a place where you don’t have to download anything, you don’t have to install any weird plugin or log in.

All you have to do is click a button and use your computer or your phone’s microphone and immediately record up to a 90-second message, which then just gets sent right to us. Well, a couple weeks ago, we heard from Mr. Beak, and he made a very specific request for us. 

Mr. Beak: Hey guys, this is Mr. Beak up in, uh, Minnesota.

Long time listener, first time caller. Been a fan for, like, five years now. Listened to many of your episodes multiple times. Uh, just wanted to pop in and say, uh, appreciate what you do. Gotten a lot of good recommendations from you guys, and I’ve also avoided a lot of terrible movies because of you guys, and I appreciate that.

I have a little bit of an ulterior motive. Figured I might as well pop in here and throw a recommendation for Happy Birthday to Me. I think you guys will have a really fun conversation about that one, especially the ending. Hope you have a good one. Bye. 

Todd: And so, uh, we decided, you know what? April is our birthday month, right?

Yeah. 

Craig: Mm-hmm. 

Todd: So here we are. Thought it would be very appropriate to go ahead and dive in to this Canadian slasher film from 1981 that has been on our list forever called Happy Birthday to Me. 

Craig: Yeah. 

Todd: And happy birthday to you, Craig. 

Craig: Well, thanks. Happy birthday to you. 

Todd: I hope you had a good one this year.

Craig: Yeah, I did. I mean, the older you get, I, I don’t know if you feel the same way, but the older you get the less eventful it feels. Like- 

Todd: Yeah, yeah … 

Craig: it really just feels like another day. Somebody will maybe- 

Todd: Do a little thing for you? Yeah. 

Craig: Yeah, do a little thing for you, but it’s no big deal, and, like, uh, that’s fine.

Right. Like it gets to a point, it gets to a point… Not to say that if you like to go out and celebrate your birthdays, good for you. You’re just probably a more fun person than I am. I’m fully content to cook a nice meal at home, maybe have a piece of cake or something and- 

Todd: Yeah … that’s 

Craig: good enough. 

Todd: That’s totally good enough for us.

We don’t even necessarily wanna be reminded of how old we’re getting. 

Craig: Right. 

Todd: And also it’s, it’s a heck of a lot better than, you know, setting nice beautiful table with party favors and decorations and a beautiful cake, and then none of your friends show up. 

Craig: Yeah, that would suck. 

Todd: That would really, really suck as we, as we hear about in this movie.

I’ve been wanting to see this movie forever, probably for the same reason you have. It has a very iconic poster- 

Clip: Mm-hmm … 

Todd: and cover that is impossible to miss of a guy basically getting a shish kebab skewer through his mouth. And it’s hard to miss. It’s very… It, it’s, you know… I mean, you don’t see blood or anything.

It’s right just before the moment of impact, but- Mm-hmm … you know, it makes a statement. 

Craig: Yeah. 

Todd: I read that the makers of the film were not so keen on that. They, they really had preferred that things be a little more subtle and not focus so much on the violence of the movie. But, you know, that’s what it’s here for.

It’s a typical ’80s slasher coming on the heels of Halloween and a whole bunch of other Canadian slashers that came out around this time, of which we have reviewed a ton. 

Craig: Yeah. 

Todd: And it does have the effect of making you wait to w- when’s that shish kebab scene gonna come in come into play? True. I spent most of the movie like, “Is this it?

Is this it? Oh, they’re eating some food. Is this gonna be the shish kebab?” And then it comes at the weirdest time. Yeah. And there’s so much about this movie that I loved to laugh at, that I can’t wait to talk about it. If even just the cover art alone, the poster says, “John will never eat shish kebab again,” even though there is no character named John in this movie.

No. And then it says… It literally, all this is printed on the poster on this, on this photo. “Steven will never ride a motorcycle again. Greg will never lift weights again. Who’s killing Crawford High’s snobbish top 10? At the rate they’re going, there will be no one left for J- Virginia’s birthday party alive.”

I love it. 

Craig: Yeah. 

Todd: I love it, and I love the spirit of it. 

Craig: That lays it out pretty well. Yeah, there’s, there, there is no John. There’s, I mean, I, there’s a Steven if you count the fact that he’s French and- … it’s the French version of Steven. But- 

Todd: Yeah, there’s another Steven. He doesn’t die that way … 

Craig: think I read that, um, maybe the poster was designed before they had even really finalized the script or- 

Todd: Yeah.

And that’s not uncommon. It happens a lot. 

Craig: Yeah. 

Todd: What we did a movie, Dolls, where the whole movie was the poster came first, and then the movie came after that. I think Terrorvision was the same. This happens all the time in these low budget q- quickie exploitation films. 

Craig: Yeah. It was also a time when you would go to the video store and you would see an interesting cover, and then you would pick it up and look at the scenes on the back and be like, “Oh, that looks good,” and then those no- scenes are nowhere to be found in the movie.

Todd: Yeah. 

Craig: I remember that happening multiple times, and that was a little frustrating. It, it 

Todd: does. Ugh. 

Craig: Ugh. 

Todd: I, I had not seen this before. Had you? 

Craig: No. And really, the title is, you know, uh, I don’t know if it’s familiar or if it’s just such a… I, I was aware that there was a movie out there called Happy Birthday to Me, but for whatever reason, I don’t know if I just never naturally came across it or If I looked at the back or something and it didn’t look particularly appealing to me.

I mean, it’s surprising to me. I love these old slashers. And now, as I’ve said a bazillion times on this show, having seen it, I’m really surprised I hadn’t seen it before. 

Todd: Right? Yeah. 

Craig: And I’m really surprised that I hadn’t even seen it referenced all that often, because this isn’t some little, you know, indie film that…

You know, this was, this had a lot of money behind it. It was a big studio film. 

Todd: Yeah. 

Craig: There were, you know, the production team behind it had, you know, uh- Serious experience … 

Todd: I, I think 

Craig: that… Yeah, and like they helped launch the career of, like, Ivan Reitman and some other Canadian folks. 

Todd: Well, even J. Lee Thompson, the director here, was already a well-respected director in the…

He’s, he’s British. 

Craig: An Oscar nominee. 

Todd: Yeah, Oscar nominee. He did– He ended up, after this movie, he ended… And he’s a, he was an old guy by this time. He was already, well, not that old. 60, I think. In 40s or 60s. But then after this, he went on to work for Cannon. 

Craig: Uh-huh. 

Todd: And did a whole ton of those Cannon movies in the, in the ’80s, and that’s more or less, I think, how he more or less finished out his career.

He was very well respected. He was well known for bringing movies in very efficiently, usually within the budget and under the time. Gregory Peck himself listed him as one of the only four directors he could trust to tell him whether or not he was faking his performance. 

Craig: Oh, wow. 

Todd: He directed one of the Planet of the Apes movies.

He was originally gonna direct the original. And he was a great fan of Martin Scorsese, and you can tell from, I think, this movie that it has a lot of early, especially early Scorsese vibe to it, and- 

Craig: Mm-hmm … 

Todd: and I, and ultimately I felt like it was a pretty well-made movie, really well put together. It looked beautiful, had some interesting cinematography and- 

Craig: Yeah

Todd: like you said, a l- clearly a lot of talent behind it before you even get to the actors. 

Craig: Right. And, and, you know, the effects look good. It’s really well shot. I, I think that it suffers from a pretty weak script and ultimately they kinda didn’t know what they were doing and there was a big rewrite right at the end which kind of throws everything else off a little bit.

Clip: Yeah. 

Craig: But it looks really good. A- and like I said, the effects look really good. So there’s obviously skill and talent going into it, but when you’re working with a script that’s relatively mediocre. Now you said that it was kind of a typical ’80s slasher, and it is. And that it was typical is part of the reason they felt like they needed to change things up at the end with that rewrite.

Todd: Mm. 

Craig: But though it’s typical in formula, I feel like it does make a solid effort to try to stand out. 

Todd: Yes. 

Craig: It’s right there on the poster, the, the shish kabob thing. The other kills are unique in a similar way. It’s just, you know, not something that you see every day. 

Todd: Right. 

Craig: It’s not just a guy with a machete.

It’s not just a guy with an ax. It’s not just a guy with a gimmick. It’s just let’s find some creative ways to kill these people, gruesome ways, and make it look really good And then you’ve kind of got the standard whodunit with a black gloved figure s- creeping around and- Yeah … lots of killer POV and that kind of stuff.

But that stuff works too. 

Todd: It does. It’s very giallo inspired, especially, I think, the ending. As convoluted as the whole thing ends up becoming and how it’s rooted to this mysterious past of this main character that we get revealed to us over time that’s, itself is kind of crazy. I think it seems like around this era, the Canadian slasher films were doing a lot to cop off of the Italian giallos- Yeah

whereas the American slasher films seem to be going a different direction. W- watching this, it reminded me a lot of Sweet Sixteen and The Initiation. 

Craig: Oh, yeah. 

Todd: And you know, those movies- 

Craig: We’ve done 100 of them. 

Todd: We have. And even Prom Night, they lean heavy into the mystery. 

Craig: Yeah, Terror Train. 

Todd: Terror Train, uh, Graduation Day.

A lot of the same actors in some of these. 

Craig: Uh-huh. 

Todd: But they lean heavily into the mystery. And just like the Italian giallo movies, one of the ways they preserve the mystery is they just go to the same formula of a lot of killer POV with the black gloves. And so you can never tell if it’s a man or a woman or what their physicality is or anything like that.

Craig: Right. 

Todd: And also there’s… I, I thought hilariously in this movie they did that old trope where the person sees the killer. Of course, we don’t see the killer, but the person sees and it’s like, “Oh, hey, it’s you.” “

Craig: Oh, hey.” “

Todd: How are you doing? Uh, hey, what’s that knife doing in your hand?” God. 

Craig: I love that gag. I love that gag.

Todd: That gag happens, like, three times in this movie and it’s so charming. 

Craig: Yeah. The other thing, and I don’t know if it’s a good thing or bad thing, but it was clearly very intentional, but it was so over the top that I al- You know, it’s funny, but I kind of couldn’t help but roll my eyes. This movie is just chock-full of kind of the most ridiculous red herrings.

Todd: Yes. 

Craig: Like, so many r- red herrings. 

Todd: The most ridiculous ones I, maybe we’ve encountered altogether in a movie to date. 

Craig: It, it, it’s directed in such a way that- For no reason, a character that has seemed pretty innocuous for most of the time will just all of a sudden be out of their mind, like acting cuckoo crazy- 

Todd: Threatening people

Craig: insane. 

Todd: Yeah. 

Craig: Yeah. And, and like very threatening and like these big leering scary looks and saying very ominous things. It’s obvious to the point where you’re like, “Well, we’re only an hour in. Are, I mean, are we really finding out who it is?” And- 

Todd: Right … 

Craig: but no. I mean, they’re- But they’re in- they’re inexplicable.

Like you, you can’t rationally explain these scenes. 

Todd: No, they’re just shoehorned in. There are whole 10-minute sequences that are just there to serve as red herrings. There are whole long drawn out things that just have a gag at the end. 

Craig: Uh-huh. 

Todd: It’s so hilarious how bald it is, and it contributes to this movie’s running time of almost two hours.

Craig: Yeah, it’s too long. 

Todd: It’s far too long. It … I had to do this movie in chunks. I mean, don’t get me wrong, I was engaged, I was curious, but I did have to take a break every now and then. Uh-huh. It, it, it tried my patience just a little bit because it was really heavy on mystery and, uh, drama, and it’s really spaced out the kills quite a bit.

And it was just doing so much silliness that I couldn’t… Like, you couldn’t even take it seriously after a while, right? You- 

Craig: Yeah, and the tone, I, I, I don’t even know that I would say it was uneven. I just am not exactly sure because at times it was to the level of parody- … it almost felt like. But then at other times it would take it pretty seriously.

Todd: Yeah. 

Craig: Ultimately, I think it’s silly and was intended to at least be somewhat silly, but you’re right. Like, so much time is spent on misdirection and then there’s backstory, which is great. I love a good backstory and I like when a good backstory is meted out to us- Yeah, parceled out over time … a little bit at a time.

Yeah. But this one just took too long. I’m like, “Ugh.” 

Todd: Oh, it’s… And there’s so much to it. 

Craig: And, and there’s so much to it. And then this- It always kind of bothers me too. Uh, there’s, you know, you get these little bits and pieces of the main character’s flashbacks to obviously some traumatic event. But then near the very end, there’s just like a 25-minute exposition dump.

Todd: Yeah , which you never saw coming and could not, could not have really seen coming. No. It’s so convoluted. And that’s what I loved about the ending. I can’t wait to talk about the ending because it’s just layer upon layer upon layer. Oh, it’s one of the more unhinged, I think, of the twist endings that we’ve seen from this era.

Craig: It, yeah. And, and, uh, like you said, I’m excited to get to it too. But the woman who plays the mom, like she’s just unhinged. It’s- … it’s great. All right, but we, we should set it up. Okay. So- Yeah … we’re at, I guess, a, like private preparatory high school. 

Todd: Yeah, I guess. 

Craig: Seemingly mostly for wealthy people, but they do have, you know, uh, students- Normal-

on scholarships and things … normies in there. Right. Right. But we are following the top 10, which is a group of 10 of these kids who are like the richest and the most popular, and they can do whatever they want, and they get away with whatever they want, and they pretty exclusively hang out with each other and just swap each other around.

That- 

Todd: Oh my God … 

Craig: like sexually. 

Todd: That was so crazy. There were so many times in here where I was like, “What? What? She’s with him now? What? What? They’re together now? Why did he just ask her out in front of him?” Like there were so many- 

Craig: Yeah, in the same space. They’ll just like… The- A guy will just hop from one girl to the next, you know, right there in the open out in front of everybody.

Ugh. And it, it creates like tension and jealousy within the group, but not really ’cause- Not 

Todd: really. They- 

Craig: They just keep hopping. 

Todd: It’s, it, it’s tension and jealousy for like four lines, and then it moves on. Yeah. 

Craig: Yeah. Boy, it’s wild. But whatever. It’s crazy. They’re young, good for them. They’re not, they’re not high school age.

They looked like this was a remake of 30-something or whatever, but- It 

Todd: looked like St. Elmo’s Fire. 

Craig: It did look like St. Elmo’s Fire. It took me… It, I, I really had to convince myself. Like I’m still… I’m watching for things in the movie, I’m like, “These kids have to be in high school. I mean, there’s no way, but they have to be.”

And, and they are. 

Todd: But not the actors. 

Craig: No, not the actors. Yeah. There’s several familiar faces in there. The, the main character, her na- The character’s name is Virginia. She’s played by Melissa Sue Anderson, who was the blind girl in Little House on the Prairie, right? 

Todd: Yeah, Mary Ingalls, the older, uh… Well, was she blind?

I… Wasn’t she, um- 

Craig: She was at least blind sometimes- Okay … because I… Maybe she lost her sight at some point in the run. I don’t remember. Okay. But I remem- I don’t remember a lot of specifics about that show, but I remember really liking it when I was a kid, and I remember thinking she was one of those most beautiful girls I’d ever seen.

Uh, and, and she’s got these icy blue eyes. But, you know, she was kind of an American sweetheart. Oh, yeah. You know, that was a really wholesome show. She was very wholesome on it, you know, a, a good girl on it. And so coming over to do something like this, I think she took a break from shooting Little House to come do this It was a big change for her, but she was also very much a familiar enough face that she would also be a draw for audiences.

Todd: Yeah. 

Craig: There was one other guy that was so familiar to me, and I’m sure that part of the reason that he’s familiar is he- ’cause he’s got this great big honker of a nose. 

Todd: Yes, Matt Craven. 

Craig: Matt Craven. He’s not a bad-looking guy. No. He just has really y- defined figures. And I’m like, “I know I’ve seen that guy before.”

I had to look him up, and I’m like, “Yep, sure have, in, like, 150 million things.” 

Todd: Yeah. TV and movies. 

Craig: Yeah, steadily in TV and movies since, like, the late ’70s. And, and not just, like, B-list stuff, like big TV shows and stuff. Like 

Todd: Crimson Tide and A Few Good Men and Jacob’s Ladder- Uh-huh … and X-Men, like, you know, big things.

Yeah. But definitely bouncing between television and movies quite a bit. 

Craig: Was there anybody else that stood out to you? Those were the only ones that stood out to me. 

Todd: I mean, Tracy Bregman. She was Ann. Soaps. I, I… D- I mean, did you recogni- You were a big Days of Our Lives fan. She was on- Yeah … Days of Our Lives for forever.

Twice. Who did she 

Craig: play? What was her character’s 

Todd: name? Two runs. She was Donna Temple Craig for- Yeah … from ’78 to ’80. Maybe that was before your time. 

Craig: That was before my 

Todd: time. But then she did Young and the Restless and The Bold and the Beautiful. She’s still doing the Young and the Restless since 1983. 

Craig: She looks really good- 

Todd: Yeah

Craig: today. She looks really 

Todd: good. She looks fantastic. 

Craig: The other kids, quote-unquote kids, some of them looked familiar to me and… But that may just be because their tropes were so familiar. 

Todd: Yeah. 

Craig: Especially, I thought, you know, the kind of awkward, nerdy one who has, like, a pocket rat and is, like- 

Todd: Oh, 

Craig: yeah … crushing on the main character.

He looked familiar to me, but I don’t know that I necessarily recognized him. 

Todd: He’s like a caricature of all those characters in these movies. He looks like- Yeah … Ted Raimi, you know? I mean, he just… Yeah. I… He… You’re right. Nerdy. 

Craig: He does kinda look like Ted Raimi, that’s right. 

Todd: Mm. 

Craig: But th- there are 10 of them.

They are the 10. That’s too many. 

Todd: Far too many. Oh my God. 

Craig: I- And it’s, it’s, it’s too many, uh, not only because it’s too many of us to keep track of, a bunch of buttholes really that I don’t really care about for the most part- 

Todd: Yes. … 

Craig: but also too many to even get to, if I remember correctly. Like, it seems like this gr- ultimately this group of kids is, is being targeted, but I…

They don’t get to all 10, I don’t think. 

Todd: No, they don’t get to all 10, no, unfortunately. 

Craig: Ugh, which is weird. 

Todd: Yeah, it is kind of a, a failing, but also, like, God, I mean, 10 is a lot. In a Friday the 13th movie, you could do 10. You know, you can hack off two people at once while they’re screwing in the tent or something like that.

Well, yeah. Or s- But, but with this, when you’re adding so much mystery and drama and character work in between, you’re gonna have a hard time getting to 10. 

Craig: Right, exactly. Like in Friday the 13th, the kills come at a much faster pace. These are drawn out a little bit. So yeah, I mean, it takes almost two hours to get through the six or seven or however many it is that they ultimately get through.

But anyway, the opening kill is one of these girls. W- uh, her name is Bernadette. She’s headed to the local bar where they hang out a- and drink as high school students. Okay. 

Todd: She… Oh, that actress, uh, Leah, by the way, uh, Leslie Donaldson, she was in, um, Curtains- 

Craig: Oh … 

Todd: as well around this time, which we did. 

Craig: She’s…

Yeah. She’s, she’s on her way there, and she gets stopped by the headmistress. The headmistress is this stuck-up older lady who comes in every once in a while to chastise them for being wild and- … rich and unappreciative, and blah, blah, blah, all that stuff. 

Clip: Bernadette O’Hara, do you have any idea what time it is?

Where are you going? Well, I, I was just going up to the village to meet some of the kids at the inn. You mean the second home for the Crawford Top 10, don’t you? Isn’t that what the elite of the senior class like to call themselves? I guess so.

Yes, Mrs. Patterson. Do you know, Bernadette, if you and the other so-called members of the top 10 would spend half the time on your books that you do down at that inn, you could all be in Harvard tomorrow Patterson 

Craig: But Bernadette gets in her car, she gets grabbed by a gloved assailant from the backseat, and this is a, you know, a somewhat prolonged- 

Todd: Yeah

Craig: m- maybe even too much death where the violence in the car where he’s trying to strangle her, and it goes on for a while, was pretty disturbing. Yeah. And I thought set a really dark tone, and so I was anticipating that dark tone throughout. It seems like she dies, but I don’t know if she was faking or if she just came back to all of a sudden or whatever, but she jumps up and she gets away and she runs away.

Now, this part, it’s not like it went on for five minutes or anything, but she just kind of runs away for a few minutes, hiding behind- … I don’t know, stuff for a while. 

Todd: She’s so dumb. Run, hide for five minutes to catch her breath until the guy grabs at her again, then she runs another 12 feet and waits again.

Yeah. Uh, y- it’s so hilarious, this, the way this beginning o- starts out, but it is a bit brutal. 

Craig: Yeah, and ultimately she just kind of runs into him. This is all happening in the dark, of course. She kind of runs into him, and he just slashes her throat. 

Todd: But it’s, it’s key that she, she recognizes this person.

Craig: Oh, that’s right. 

Todd: Yeah. “Oh my God, thank God you’re here. It’s you. There’s somebody after me.” And then slash to the throat. Right. Which is quick and shocking. 

Craig: One of the tamer, i- in terms of gore, probably the tamest of the, uh, kills. 

Todd: Well, they had to cut a lot to avoid the X rating apparently. There were quite a few seconds cut from almost every kill scene.

So, like, there was supposed to be more blood gushing out of her wound. We were just supposed to linger a little bit longer on some of these, and, and that’s, and that’s gone. I don’t know if that footage exists somewhere or not. I, I looked for it online, and I couldn’t find it, so… 

Craig: I, I, I heard that there is a, a print somewhere, I don’t know if it’s a European print or something, but that you can find one that has s- most if not all of that put back in.

But I didn’t know that until after the fact, so I didn’t bother looking for it. But then we’re introduced to all of the other- 

Todd: Assholes … 

Craig: kids. 

Todd: Table full of assholes. 

Craig: Yeah, they, I mean, they are kinda… I hate to say that, but they really are. 

Todd: Well, we say that all the time, right? L- it’s, it’s a shocking movie when we’re like, “You know, these guys are actually pretty good.

They’re nice to each other. They get along. They’re helpful.” No, this is, like, a group of assholes sitting around a table in a bar, and they start out that way. 

Craig: The guys especially are, seem like real dicks and- Yeah … like, are constantly, like, flirting with each other’s girls and kissing each other’s girls right in front of the, their guy and- 

Todd: Antagonizing each other, antagonizing people- Yeah

around them, starting fights. 

Craig: Yeah. 

Todd: Like, my 

Craig: word. It, it’s one of those groups of people that, like, why are you guys friends? Like- … you’re not nice to each other. I, I, I mean, I really think it’s just kind of based on their status, the, the fact- Yeah … that they’re the Richie Riches of the school. 

Todd: That may be the point.

Craig: Yeah, I, I, I think so. I, I’m not really sure why they hang out with Alfred, the nerdy one, because he doesn’t appear to be wealthy except for that he can make incredibly intricate movie props in his house, which again is another one of those red herrings that goes nowhere. 

Todd: Yes. 

Craig: It, it’s crazy. 

Todd: And, and for far too long.

Craig: Here’s the, here’s an example of how these guys treat each other. Steve Craven, whatever that guy’s name is, Alfred, the nerdy one, has a pet pocket rat. He keeps it in his pocket, and they ask to see it and, and like hold it. But then, like he gives it to a girl, and she takes it very gently or whatever, and then he turns away for a second.

I think he’s trying to flirt with Virginia. But when he turns back, he’s like, “Where’s my rat?” And she’s like, “Oh, I dropped it.” So he starts looking around for it on the floor. Well, it turns out that she’s just passed it over to Steve, who takes it and as a prank on some guys that they are beefing with, some like Shriners or something- Hmm

that they’re beefing with in this bar, takes that guy’s pet rat and drops it in a s- beer stein full of beer to give to the guy. That’s mean. Yeah. That’s mean. 

Todd: It’s mean to the rat. 

Craig: Like that’s that guy’s pet. Yeah. Fortunately, the rat is fine. I don’t think that we ever see it again. No. But, uh- 

Todd: As soon as I saw this rat, I said, “Oh, this is gonna be a thing, right?

Something bad’s gonna happen to this guy’s rat, and he’s gonna be so distraught.” And then he’s gonna be 

Craig: mad. Yeah. 

Todd: Yeah. No, it didn’t happen. That was one of the few things that they… I really thought they were gonna go somewhere with that, and it, it didn’t go anywhere. 

Craig: That bar scene goes on for a little while, and you kind of meet…

There’s actually a couple of girls who don’t play big roles at all that seem okay. There’s one in particular, the one that dates the douchey blonde guy. 

Todd: Mm-hmm. 

Craig: She seem, she seems actually kind of sweet and- Is it Anne? … doesn’t really do anything, but… No, not Anne. Anne is, um, Virginia’s best friend. 

Todd: Ah, right.

Uh, Maggie. 

Craig: Maybe Maggie. I don’t know. I didn’t even write them all down. Anne does seem like she genuinely cares about Virginia. 

Todd: Mm-hmm. 

Craig: For example, after this next scene that is very traumatic for Virginia, y- you should s- because this was wild to me. Like, the, the whole chicken, the playing chicken, “S- let’s play the game.”

Oh my 

Todd: God. 

Craig: So they get chased out of the bar by, you know, the guy who runs the place, and they all start jumping in their cars, and you start hearing the, the bells. I couldn’t tell if it was a train or a drawbridge, bridge. It turns out it’s a drawbridge. And they’re like, “Let’s play the game.” Well, they split up into like five cars or something like that.

Todd: Mm-hmm. Oh, and it’s, somebody’s also on a motorcycle. 

Craig: Yes. Yeah, I think somebody was on a motorcycle. But anyway, what they’re doing is they’re playing chicken on this drawbridge. So as it goes up, they are like driving their cars and like jumping the gap. 

Todd: So 

Craig: stupid And it’s crazy. Yeah. Like, even, even the very first couple that go over, like, that is far too dangerous and, and far too risky.

Even y- So okay, so maybe you only have two or three feet to jump. Th- There are so many variables there that could go wrong. But by the time it’s the car, there are, like, four of them, and the two last cars, one of them chickens out. But the guy that’s driving the very last car is gonna go for it anyway, and Virginia is in that car, and we find out immediately after that she has never done this before.

Todd: Yeah. 

Craig: This car inexplicably makes the jump, but that dude destroyed his car. 

Todd: Yeah. 

Craig: Like- 

Todd: Smashed the whole front… I mean, the engine is totally gone in that car. 

Craig: And then I, I don’t even remember seeing this, but I read in the trivia that later on you see the car again and it’s all fixed. It’s ridiculous. I mean, the stunt looks good.

Todd: Oh, yeah. It’s exciting. It’s a really exciting way, actually, to, to kick the movie off, and I think that these first 15 minutes of the movie really moved. 

Craig: They did. They did. But Virginia is pissed, as I would be too. She didn’t even know what she was getting into. So when they finally stop, she gets out of the car and she’s angry and she just runs away, and they’re like, “We better go get her,” and somebody’s like, “No, she just lives right over there.”

And then apparently there’s a cemetery- … between the highway and her house. 

Todd: Yeah. Like, practically in her backyard. 

Craig: It is, and she walks and she stops at this grave, and it’s her mom, and there’s a box with some shears there, and she’s, like, cleaning up the grave. Again- … this is, like, midnight. 

Todd: Think about it.

Midnight. After she’s run away from this distressful thing. I mean, you just know they were sitting there with the script and they’re like, “Well, where are we gonna stick this scene? I don’t know, let’s just, let’s just put it after the car jump.” 

Craig: We’ve got to establish with- We’ve got dead mom, so she’s got trauma.

Clip: Mother, I miss you so much. You’d be proud of me now, Mother

All the kids like me. I’m even one of the top 10. W- we go everywhere together 

Craig: And then she goes home. Meanwhile, Black Gloves is following her. We, uh, of course, we don’t know who it is- Mm … until she runs into… Which guy is it? I can’t remember. 

Todd: Etienne, yeah, the French dude. 

Craig: The French dude. 

Todd: Etienne, this random guy who we haven’t seen yet.

He wasn’t there at the… I don’t think he was there at the 

Craig: bar. I, I think he was. There’s just so many, it’s hard to tell. Oh, okay. But I think he was. If you say so. I think he’s one of them. 

Todd: Well, he just stops her and is very sinister. He reaches through the gate, and he doesn’t have a very nice look on his face.

And he’s like, “I’ll walk you home.” She’s like, “Ugh.” And I’m like, “Oh my God, there’s way too many people already. I can’t even tell who’s who.” But here’s your first red herring, because Virginia goes home, and while she goes into her home, which is right by the cemetery conveniently, he’s stalking her. He’s, like, walking towards the house, and he looks in the window, and I’m getting serious Nightmare on Elm Street vibes this whole time.

Obviously, this was before Nightmare on Elm Street, but you’ve got to imagine this movie was a l- inspired it a little bit, ’cause there are some parallels here that are kind of interesting. And part of it is this guy. She comes home, and she’s got this relationship. Her dad is there, and he’s like, “Have you been over there again?”

Craig: The cemetery, 

Todd: right. To the cemeter- Right. Oh, “The cemetery in our backyard, have you been there again?” Uh-huh. “I’ve been telling you not to go there.” And he just doesn’t want her to visit the mom’s grave because he just wants her to get over it basically, and then he wants, wants them to move on with their lives.

By the way, we don’t know at this point why her mom is dead, how long it’s been. We are gonna learn a lot about this later. 

Craig: Yeah. And, and she says, “I, I have to keep visiting and, and thinking about it because I have to process what really happened.” “

Todd: My doctor says I’m not gonna be cured unless I do that.”

Craig: Right. 

Todd: And it’s like, whoa, okay. There’s a lot of info. Mom’s dead. She’s in some kind of- Something traumatic … process with the doctor. She needs to be cured of something. What’s all that? This all comes at us real fast in the first, you know, 15 minutes. And it’s the same trope, right? He’s like, “Sometimes I wish we’d never moved back here.”

Yeah, 

Clip: yeah. 

Todd: She’s like, “No, I like it here. All these people are my friends. We really get along.” “All right, honey, well, if you’re happy here, then I’m happy here.” Ugh, so it’s such a typical setup. Meanwhile, this guy is climbing the trellis and into her room. 

Craig: Yeah, all of these guys ultimately end up being real creeps.

Todd: Like- Yeah. Total 

Craig: creeps. And, and this is played… The score is very good, and it’s, uh, it’s suspenseful, and it, and it does a, a g- a really good job of setting a suspenseful tone, so much so that I’m, was genuinely concerned for her safety at this point. 

Todd: Yeah. 

Craig: And I thought, I, I thought, “God, we are so early in the movie, this can’t be the guy.”

Todd: Right? 

Craig: And as far as we know after this scene, it’s not him. He’s just a creep who breaks into her room, watches her get naked- Waits until she goes into the bathroom and then leaves. She hears him leave, but doesn’t know who it is, so she’s terrified because there’s been somebody in her room 

Todd: Yeah. In the meanwhile, we have been through at least 10 minutes of this scene that ultimately she hears the window that she had previously locked open up again and runs out and sees that it’s open and then shuts it, and that- that’s it.

Don’t- she didn’t get killed. In fact, there’s no nudity here either, which I was kind of shocked by. No. Actually, it was really hilarious because she goes there, takes off her shirt, and then keeps her bra on while she puts her nightgown over it. And I’m like, I’m sorry, I’ve lived with women. One of the first things they do-

when they come home is take that bra off as fast as possible. If- 

Craig: Even I know that. 

Todd: Right. There’s no way in hell, and this girl’s gonna be taking a shower in a second. There’s no way in hell that she’s putting that on. So this actress- There’s 

Craig: also no way in hell that the girl from Little House on the Prairie is showing her boobs in this movie.

It’s not gonna happen. 

Todd: It’s true. She does take her panties off, but they just end up on the floor with a nice zoom-in close-up on it, like this is going to be significant later, and it is. 

Craig: God, it’s so gross. And I didn’t even realize, ’cause it r- it didn’t seem like it was moving at a snail’s pace, like things were happening.

It just seemed like things were kind of drawn out. Yeah. It’s only now that we’re talking about it that I realize how plot heavy it is. Like- 

Todd: Yes … 

Craig: oh, we’re gonna have to get moving. 

Todd: Well, I just… I mean, we gotta point out, this is one of several scenes where it’s this long, drawn-out scene that ultimately serves as a red herring.

Craig: Yeah. 

Todd: And you know it by the end of the scene. Once you see two or three of these, every time th- there’s a killer POV, you’re kind of wondering, eh, is this just gonna be nothing? Is it, or is it actually gonna be a kill? 

Craig: Right. 

Todd: And I think that’s part of what makes the movie stretch on for so long psychologically, you know.

Craig: Yeah. But, and I will also say that this, even though, like I said, sometimes these red herrings are very melodramatic and over the top, there was always a question in my mind, is this it? 

Todd: Yeah. 

Craig: I- i- it could be. I, I don’t think it would be at this point in the movie, but it could be, and who knows? 

Todd: Well, that’s the tell, right?

Usually these things don’t get exposed so early, but then the movie plays with us there, too, as we’ll find out later. Yeah. Mm-hmm. 

Craig: Yeah, yeah. Okay, so anyway, they go back to school the next day and get lectured by the headmistress for causing trouble at the bar. 

Todd: Yeah. 

Craig: Then their science teacher does… And, and there’s gags here too with, like, he’s doing a thing with static electricity-

and his hair sticks up on end. It’s really funny. 

Todd: Uh-huh. I love that animation of the spark. 

Craig: Oh, yeah, that was great. ‘Cause this, ’cause one of these douchebag guys is, like, the scientist isn’t aware, which I’ve been to, like, a children’s museum where you can touch one of those static electricity balls and it makes your hands stand on, or hair stand all up on end.

Yeah, 

Todd: yeah. Tesla coil. 

Craig: It doesn’t hurt by any means, but it’s, it’s certainly a sensation. Like, it’s not like you wouldn’t know it was happening. 

Todd: Right. 

Craig: But the teacher’s like, “The good news is static electricity can be released,” and then he, like, touches… He doesn’t even touch that guy’s nose. He comes, like, two inches away from it and they animate a little lightning bolt-

in there. That was pretty crazy. 

Todd: It was pretty bad. 

Craig: But what he’s ultimately showing them is that he can cause reactions in, in these dead amputated frog legs. He can get the nerves to react and the legs to move, and that sparks one of her first, Virginia’s first flashbacks- 

Todd: Yeah … 

Craig: where we see her twitching on a table.

We don’t get very much information. 

Todd: Looks like an MRI sorta thing. It’s some machine that’s wrapped, and her head is in this thing. 

Craig: Yeah, it looks like a giant circular magnet, like a miniature Stargate or something. 

Todd: Yeah. Around her head, yeah. 

Craig: Yeah. And, and she’s bald and she’s got, like, drill marks in her head and stuff.

There’s some exposition about this later that ultimately I didn’t really understand, but I also didn’t care, so- 

Todd: Uh-huh … 

Craig: but, but there’s some things going on with her. And then she immediately goes and visits her doctor, David, right? 

Todd: Real quick, that ends with her sitting up and going, “My, my birthday.” And, and I was like, “Oh, okay.”

The, uh, like I, I was wondering by now when the birthday would come into place, you know? Because we’re- 

Craig: Yeah … 

Todd: the whole movie. And, and I think at this point we’re in doctor’s office and- 

Craig: Yeah, but I, I, I’m still a little bit confused by this because- 

Todd: Mm-hmm … 

Craig: this isn’t the doctor who performed the procedure on her.

Todd: No, no, no. 

Craig: This is just some other doctor that, like- 

Todd: Psychiatrist, I think … 

Craig: befriended her? Okay. I 

Todd: think this is… And, and they have an interesting relationship. By the way, we’re talking about famous people. This is probably the most famous person in this whole movie. Yeah. Glenn Ford, star of the silver screen since a very long time.

Very famous guy. A very surprising, I thought, that he was in this movie. But I mean, this guy was Pa in the ’78 Superman. 

Craig: Right. Yes. Apparently, he was miserable making this movie. I don’t know if he needed the money or what, but I guess he was… You know, and of course all of this is things that I read. I don’t, I, I can’t verify it, but- You 

Todd: don’t know him?

You didn’t ask him? 

Craig: I didn’t, no. I wasn’t there, and I don’t wanna disparage anybody if it’s not true. But what I read was that he was drinking heavily throughout, and he didn’t like the script, and he made it very obvious to anybody who would listen that he felt that it was beneath him and- 

Todd: Started a fight with his AD, right?

Like, at one point. 

Craig: Yeah. Mm. Punched his AD, I think, in the face- … and then hid in his, uh, dressing room and refused to come out until the AD came and apologized- … which he did. To be fair, Glenn Ford apologized for his role in it, too, but- Still. Yeah, but that, it’s, you know, you wouldn’t know. He puts in a fine performance.

He, he doesn’t really have a whole lot to do except kind of be a catalyst for us to get the backstory and to kind of move us through this process that she’s going through, I guess. And he’s a father figure for her because her dad, it seems like they have a pretty good relationship, but he also seems like he’s kind of absentee.

Todd: Yeah. 

Craig: Like, he’s away for work a lot. And so David, Dr. David, is kind of a surrogate father figure for her, and she, she looks to him for help and support throughout the whole movie. 

Todd: Yeah, and unusual, I think, for these kinds of movies, particularly at this time, the psychiatrist doesn’t have ulterior motives.

He’s not a little creepy. There was only one moment in here, much later on, when I thought, “God, could it be this guy?” Because that would be one of the most unlikely scenarios. Maybe that’s why, you know, maybe that’s gonna be the big twist to this movie. 

Craig: I did find him suspicious because it seemed unlikely to me that he, he took…

I don’t know. I don’t wanna give anything away yet, but, like, it appears that bad things are happening. 

Todd: Yeah. 

Craig: You know, the, Bernadette’s already disappeared. Somebody else is gonna disappear here in a minute, but these kids keep disappearing, but no bodies are ever found. 

Todd: Right. 

Craig: And he seems to be pretty blase, like, “Oh, they’re just missing.

I’m sure it’s fine.” And, and I kept thinking, surely there’s gotta be more to it th- going on than that, and surely you can’t be that naive. But- 

Todd: Yeah … 

Craig: who knows. So I, I found him a little bit suspicious, but- 

Todd: There was a point where I thought maybe this guy, in his position, is using her trauma and his influence to either manipulate her into murdering these people or he’s murdering the people, but he’s manipulating her into thinking she’s doing it.

You know what I mean? Yeah. Like, trying to set her up. That, that’s definitely probably about, mm, halfway through maybe, that notion came to mind. But other than that, they’re almost a little too close at times . Like, they get a little… There’s some long embraces there. 

Craig: There was w- yeah. Very near the end, there’s one moment where she is distraught And they’re, like, sitting in front of a fire.

And he, I think, it’s- she’s like, “It’s my birthday.” And he’s like, “Oh, it’s midnight. It is your birthday.” And he reaches out and kind of brushes her hair to the side and strokes her face with the back of his fingers, and she reaches up and grabbed his hand- Uh-huh … and kissed his fingers, and there was the briefest second where I thought she was gonna put his fingers in her mouth.

And I was like, “Wow.” I, I really wonder, I, I, I would not be at all surprised to find that that was specifically directed in that way- Ah, right … to, to make us a little bit uncomfortable because- 

Todd: Probably … 

Craig: you know, and it, it could, it could be innocent. It could be. 

Todd: Well- 

Craig: But it, it, you know, in front of the fire and, uh, yeah, it was a little strange.

Todd: You had said it earlier, and I just kinda wanna reiterate it now. I think that th- these Canadian films in particular felt a little darker and more unsettling overall. Like, they gen- they tend to have that tone for whatever reason than what we were seeing being done in the States, es- especially as we get into the ’80s and we have the f- the big franchises and stuff like that, where, where things are kinda goofy.

These tend to insert a lot of these kind of uncomfortable moments and these unresolved psychological things between people and these- Mm-hmm … traumatic backstories that you wonder where they’re gonna lead to and, and just very somber at times. And I like that about them. That’s what I, why I kind of enjoy watching these old Canadian slashers is because they all kind of have that tone.

I think Curtains, in a very self-aware way, took that and tried to run with it and make it a thing. Mm. But they all have that element to them, I think, throughout, and that’s what I really enjoy about these Canadian movies is the, all this ambiguity. 

Craig: Yeah, yeah. It’s interesting. It’s, it’s intriguing. 

Todd: Mm-hmm.

Craig: So, so then there’s a whole motocross scene. 

Todd: Ah. It’s the ’80s. Motocross. 

Craig: Yeah. French guy is doing motocross, and of course all of his friends are betting on him, and he wins, and then he shows Virginia that he has her panties, that he took them. I’m like, “W- what kind of game is this?” Like, you, do you think this is gonna turn a girl on?

That is so creepy. 

Todd: And of course it doesn’t turn her on at all. 

Craig: No. She storms away, and he’s like, “Okay, I’ll meet up with the rest of you when I’m done cleaning up my bike.” So he goes to clean up his bike, and we see the killer slowly creep down the stairs and into the room where he’s cleaning his bike.

And my God, this could not… The, this death could not have been more projected, but I almost like that because you’re just anticipating it. Mm. And, and it, it takes its time. 

Todd: It sure does. 

Craig: Well, first of all, this guy, this creepy French guy, is down working on his bike, and, and he’s got it, I think, upside down or, or- Upside down

propped up or whatever so that the wheel is spinning on its axle. And he is wearing, for reasons unknown, a huge, long knit scarf. And my first thought was, “You deserve to die.” 

Todd: Oh, my God. You are the most careless person. 

Craig: I can think of very less stupid things than wearing something long and dangling from your neck while working next to a spinning tire on its axle with spokes.

I knew that. And so it’s just him down there tooling around, the wheel’s spinning, spinning, spinning and- In 

Todd: the 

Craig: basement, 

Todd: by the way. I don’t think you’d wanna run your motorbike in the basement for 

Craig: very long. Probably not. That was ridiculous. And the killer just slowly walks up behind him, like slowly, slowly, slowly, then stands there for a good 10, 15 seconds, then just gingerly picks up one end of the scarf and tosses it into the wheel, and that guy gets his face peeled off by the wheel.

Todd: Yeah. 

Craig: And then again, for reasons that I don’t understand, Virginia and Anne, best friends, they all get drunk together. Of course, they notice that Frenchie never shows up, but they’re like, “Okay, whatever. His girlfriend’s kind of upset, I think. I don’t know.” But Virginia and Anne break into Alfred’s house.

Todd: Why? 

Craig: Alfred’s the nerdy one. 

Todd: Why? 

Craig: I don’t know. 

Todd: Why did they break into his house? That was so contrived. 

Craig: I don’t know, and they just kept saying, like, “I wonder if he’s stuffing things in there.” Like, “He’s always stuffing things in there.” 

Todd: Like he’s got a taxidermy obsession or something like that? 

Craig: And he, apparently he does, because they go in there and he’s got a bunch of taxidermied stuff, but then he also has what appear to be a bunch of pretty intricate horror movie props, one of which is Bernadette’s severed head.

And then, so they see that and they turn to run, but he, like, pops out from behind a curtain and is like, “What are you doing here?” And then he’s very super, super ominous. 

Clip: We were worried because you didn’t show up at the inn. You were worried about me?

Where is About me? Maybe you were 

Mr. Beak: worried about Bernadette

Clip: What about poor little Bernadette? 

Mr. Beak: How do you like her? 

Clip: My latest masterpiece. She is a masterpiece, isn’t she? I’m, I’m very proud of her

I’ll tell you something

If you’re both very good You can be my next models 

Craig: And he goes over to it, and then he pulls out what appears to be a glass eyeball, and basically that’s the end of the scene. Ugh. And we never really hear anything about it ever again. 

Todd: Now- Like … it’s so stupid. And, and again, this is another one of those super long, drawn-out things that a big deal is made of it, and it turns out to be an obvious red herring because of course he’s not gonna be the killer, right?

Not after this. But did they know that Bernadette was dead at this point? No. No. So they didn’t know that her head was cut o- that she was sliced. They don’t know that she’s dead. They just know she hasn’t been around, but nobody really cares. 

Craig: No. 

Todd: They’re just commenting on it, like, once or twice. So none of this really makes a lot of sense.

It certainly doesn’t make sense that he would coincidentally been working on a head prop. It’s so dumb. 

Craig: Yeah. It doesn’t make any sense. It’s just a b- and then he acts super creepy even though- Oh, boy … he’s never really acted creepy before, and he never, never really acts creepy again except for that he kind of follows Virginia around a little bit ’cause he likes her or whatever.

But anyway, then there’s some nonsense with the headmistress questions them all again ’cause now there are at least two kids missing, and then there’s some stupid love triangle that I’m not gonna waste time on. But- 

Todd: Yeah, Steve and Rudy are fighting. Whatever … 

Craig: Yeah, who cares? And, and there, somebody says something like, “Our group is falling apart.”

Your group- And then we cut to then we cut to the- Your group 

Todd: was never very stable, guys.

Craig: Oh. And then we cut to the big buff blonde guy, Greg, lifting weights. And again, the killer walks in. We never see face. It’s always just, like, we see him from the shoulders down. And once again, Greg’s like, “Oh, it’s you,” and just starts talking to him. So clearly this is somebody they all know. It’s got to be somebody in the group.

Todd: It has to be, especially considering what he says. He says, “Uh, so and so said we’re all falling apart.” 

Craig: Right. And this, uh, this I loved this death because- … for a while they’re just gym bros. The killer never says anything, but the… Greg is just talking. He’s like, “My weights…” He, he’s deadlifting, uh, on a bench.

He’s like, “My weights are too light. Give me some more.” And he keeps saying, “Give me more, give me more.” And eventually he’s like, “Okay, that’s enough. I’m just gonna do this one more.” And he lifts them up and he’s clearly really, really straining and he’s sweating. And as he goes to lower it back onto the bars, the killer pulls the bars away.

He’s like, “What are you doing? Put that back. Ah.” And so the… He’s holding it up with no support. And the killer goes and grabs, like, a 30-pound weight and throws it on his dick.

So he then drops the barbell on himself and is dead. However, I don’t remember when it is, but his girlfriend shows up seemingly minutes later- 

Todd: Oh, yeah, almost immediately completely. And he’s completely gone, everything’s cleaned up. 

Craig: There’s no evidence. Yeah, no evidence of 

Todd: his death. Amelia, yeah. She almost gets knocked by the weights behind the door.

That was another, another real tense moment where the weights have been set up behind the door upright, and you see the door kinda close and you see those start to tip towards her, and it just barely misses her. I thought she was gonna get it. 

Craig: Yeah. And there are other jump scares like that too. A couple of them I found, I found a little bit cheap, but they made me jump anyway, so- 

Todd: Yeah

Craig: they worked. But God, then there’s a soccer game, and the soccer star Rudy is pissed at his girlfriend ’cause she’s messing around with Steve, and so he invites- 

Todd: Virginia … 

Craig: Virginia- 

Todd: Absolutely … 

Craig: to the chapel. Like, it’s like, “Hey, what are you doing later?” She’s like, “Nothing.” He’s like, “You wanna go to the chapel?”

She’s like, “Sure.” Like- … are you going to pray? Like, what is happening? 

Todd: What kind of date is this? And Amelia’s jealous, and I’m like, boy, Virginia’s been out with, like, three different guys so far, hasn’t she? She’s been hopping around. 

Craig: Yeah. So she meets him in the chapel, where he proceeds to do some of the dumbest impressions.

And they walk through the chapel and they walk up into the bell tower, and he’s, like, swinging around on, in the rafters and stuff and acting like Quasimodo. 

Clip: I will never forget you, my darling.

Rudy. Wow, I, I just love this place, I swear. Stop. I feel just like Quasimodo. Quasimodo in the bell tower. Thank God you don’t look like him.

Give me a little kiss, Esmeralda. A little peck on the cheek Rudy, stop it. Stop it. Next thing I know, you’ll be swinging from the bell rope 

Craig: And the longer it goes on, which is a couple of minutes, it gets creepier and creepier and more threatening. And at one point he, like, is playing with the rope for the bell, the bell rope, and he’s like, “I could cut this bell rope.”

And she’s like, “No.” And I’m like, “You could cut that bell rope and what?” Like- 

Todd: I know. What was the… What, what, what’s so s- disturbing about that? I… 

Craig: Because ultimately he does, and so when the priest pulls on it, the rope just falls down. It’s not like it was, like, supporting the bell or anything. 

Todd: Har, har. 

Craig: He’s like, “I could, I could cut this bell rope because I have a knife.”

And then he pops out a knife and he’s looking at her like a Looney Tune, and he starts moving towards her and she backs into the shadows. And then it cuts to… And I knew something was up because why else would we not see this death? 

Mr. Beak: Right. 

Craig: But we see blood dripping from the bell tower into the sanctuary, onto the floor.

And then when the preacher goes to pull the rope, it has been frayed and it, it comes down, and he picks it up and looks at it, and there’s blood on it. 

Todd: And then he screams, “Help, murder.”

Oh my God, how charming. “Help, murder.” 

Craig: We immediately find out that Virginia is still alive, so I’m thinking, “Oh, she must have killed him,” because that was a very- 

Todd: Yeah … 

Craig: ominous scene or whatever. But she goes, ’cause she’s scared, so she goes back to Dr. David, and there’s… She has another flashback of her brain surgery.

Huh. Now, this is notable just because they put so much effort into the effects, so much so that they had an actual neurosurgeon play the neurosurgeon, and they did their best to make it as real as possible, and it did. I mean, it looked really good. 

Todd: Yeah. I know my brain surgery. This was authentic. 

Craig: Well, I don’t know if it…

But it was gruesome. Like, it, it- It was very 

Todd: gruesome … 

Craig: it seemed to me like they had taken off or opened up a large part of her scalp, and at some point previously had put a plate. A- and it may have been a plate of her own bone- Mm-hmm … but there was a plate, big plate in her head. And when he took it off, there’s brains, and then the brains start to pop out.

And again, this is the exposition stuff that I didn’t really understand. Because when the brain starts to pop out, the surgeon’s like, “That’s it. Call it. She’s dead.” And then she wakes up and starts screaming and freaks, and saying like, “He killed me. He-” 

Todd: Killed part of 

Craig: me. “He killed part of my brain.” 

Todd: Uh-huh. 

Craig: I don’t really know what that means.

Todd: I think, and I think it comes up later, but I think what we’re supposed to piece together eventually is that something about the accident, and I think it’s when she came up, damaged her brain, and they went through some kind of reconstruction process. That’s what the big machine was. And so her brain is still in the process of being reconstructed with this new experimental technology that that doctor just came up with recently.

And so that’s why she can’t remember things. But as her brain, over time, is reconstructing and she goes through her therapy, she’s able to remember more, and more, and more, and more. Which- God, it’s so convoluted because normally in these movies just a person’s got some amnesia and they talk to the th- s- psychiatrist for a while, and eventually it comes back in pieces, and then they can remember the thing they need to remember right at that moment in the movie where they need to.

Here they’ve got this whole long biological explanation with some experimental procedure and a crazy machine 

Craig: and shit. Yeah, something to do with ele- statoelectri- static electricity and magnetism and all kinds of weird stuff. 

Todd: To basically accomplish the same thing plot-wise, you know? It’s, it’s so s- 

Craig: Right

Todd: it’s so silly. She’s 

Craig: messed up in the brain. 

Todd: Yeah. 

Craig: Yeah. I, I had forgot to mention that after the soccer game, Rudy had seen something sticking up out of the garden and reburied it. 

Todd: Yeah. 

Craig: And aft- and after he goes missing briefly, somebody finds it and they pull it out and it’s, it’s the same scarf that the motorcycle guy- Yes

was wearing. 

Todd: Yes. 

Craig: And they also find a buried skull, and at this point everybody’s, like, standing around and the girls are, like, almost in tears ’cause they think that it’s Greg, and it turns out it’s just a skull from the science wing. Why? And, like 

Todd: Yeah … 

Craig: why in God’s name would Rudy stop and bury this thing?

Because As far as I remember, he had absolutely no connection to Greg’s death. 

Todd: Yeah. 

Craig: So, or, or whichever one it was that got pulled into the tire or whatever. Again, it’s just more red herring stuff that doesn’t pay off, and that can be frustrating. 

Todd: It was silly just ’cause it was so unrealistic. Like, what, is this just a prank, that he just likes to run these pranks in case people find them?

It, it doesn’t make sense. 

Craig: Then there’s a scene where they’re all at a pool and they’re, like, hanging out, like, in the, uh, the basement area where they have, like, windows where you can see in the pool. And one of the girls, like, pretends like she’s drowning, but I guess it’s a prank or whatever. But it freaks Virginia out and she runs out and she has a flashback of someone drowning.

I, I, I said in my notes I, I’m sure it’s her mom, and it is because she then immediately runs back to her mom’s grave at the cemetery and somebody’s creeping on her, and we see that it’s Alfred, and he also is wearing that scarf. 

Todd: Yeah. 

Craig: What? Like, what is happening? 

Todd: Everybody’s got a scarf, and there were also quite a few black gloves in this as well.

Craig: Yeah. 

Todd: I think maybe that’s part of their uniform or maybe it’s 

Craig: a- Maybe. Maybe it’s their school colors or something. 

Todd: I just kinda had to figure that out later because ultim- you know, at first we’re just, we’re just gonna be conditioned to think this is Etienne’s scarf, you know? So I couldn’t figure out how this kept popping up and why it was and why nobody was remarking on it or anything, and where it came from.

Craig: Right. 

Todd: By the way, at this point we’re only an hour in. So much has happened and it’s only halfway through the movie. 

Craig: Oh my 

Todd: God. At this point, because of the sharpness of the cuts, because so many times she would have a flashback and then she would sort of wake up from her flashback in the psychiatrist’s office, there was a part of me that was thinking, “Oh, is all of this happening in her head?”

Is this one of these movies where, like, she’s basically in the psychiatrist office the whole time, but all these murders and things are actually g- like a different story playing out in her mind? 

Craig: Well, they, they certainly steer us in that direction. Is it that? Like, is this all just in her mind, or is this, like, a Nightbreed situation where the therapist is- Mm-hmm

manipulating her for whatever reason? And I c- I really couldn’t tell because there came a point where it seemed like the therapist was covering for her. Again, I know I already said it- Yeah … but it just seemed like he was too naive to not think that there was something strange going on. 

Todd: Well, she invites him over to her house almost like it’s a date for her Sunday birthday dinner, I guess a day early, and that’s when he comes over, and I think he’s there, and she’s has this episode, and then a cop comes to the door.

Oh, no, it- maybe that’s a little later. 

Craig: Well, we skipped because she, because w- when Alfred is creeping on her in the, in the cemetery, she’s kneeling at her mother’s grave, and we know that there’s a box full of giant shears right there. Ah, uh-huh. And he goes to pull something out of his pocket. The, the music tells us it’s a weapon or something.

So she turns around and stabs him, and she’s kind of dead faced, and she stabs him with those shears, and then she just goes home. And, and we also see when he falls down that what he was pulling out of his pocket was a rose- Yes … um, that he was gonna give her or whatever. 

Todd: So yeah. 

Craig: So she just goes home. Her dad is packing for a trip, and she’s like, “Wait, when, what about Sunday?”

And he’s like, “Oh, shit, your birthday.” He promises he’ll be back, and then they go to a school dance, and she is really out of character dancing and flirting with Steve- Mm-hmm … the big nose guy. 

Todd: Mm-hmm. 

Craig: And she very seductively says, “You know, my dad’s out of town. Why don’t you come back to my place? I make a really good midnight snack.”

Todd: It’s all sexual en- entente between the two of them. I like this 

Craig: bit. Yeah. And they, and then they go back to her big mansion, and they’re, you know, laying down by the fire. Uh-huh. And the midnight snack that she made- 

Todd: Which is? … 

Craig: was shish kebabs. 

Todd: Thank God. When this came on the screen, I was like, “Finally.” It’s an odd midnight snack to be eating when you’re about to make out by the fire, but oh my God.

Craig: Yes, but I- 

Todd: Oh, they look good too. 

Craig: Yeah, they, they, they did look good. Uh, she was, like, dipping them in sauce and feeding them to him and stuff. But this is a good time for a PSA about how if you have metal- 

Todd: Skewers … 

Craig: if you, yeah, if you have the metal skewers, don’t eat directly off them. It’s dangerous. 

Todd: Yes.

Craig: Just pull all the good food off onto your plate and eat it with a fork. 

Todd: Or at least do like they do in China, eat it from the side. Bite the side and pull it through. Right. Don’t, like, put it 

Craig: straight- Don’t stick the pokey part in your mouth. 

Todd: Oh, God. 

Craig: But she does. She feeds it to him like that. She’s like, “Do you want a little bit more?”

And he opens his mouth, and she just shoves it all the way- 

Todd: Yes. Oh- … to 

Craig: the back of his head … 

Todd: that was so satisfying. 

Craig: It was good. 

Todd: Oh, and that’s when I had to take a break. I was like, “All right. This movie’s gone on for a while. I need to take a break,” but I, I got to that point. I need to 

Craig: And it just cuts to the next morning, and she wakes up to Anne, her friend, like, I don’t know, throwing a rock at the window or something, knocking at the door or whatever, and she leans out her second story window, Virginia does, and says What time is it?

Oh, it’s noon. We were supposed to be somewhere at 9:00 or something like that. I don’t know. And she says, “Oh, man, I don’t remember anything about last night.” Yes. And Anne’s like, “

Todd: Mm-hmm.” 

Craig: So she throws Anne down the keys and says, “Come on up, I have to take a shower.” 

Todd: Oh, by the way, she’s got a great line here when she calls up- 

Clip: Come on, it’s time to get up.

I wanna hear all the gory details about you and Steve last night. 

Craig: Yeah. Yeah, yeah, that was good. That was a good line. Oh, 

Todd: it’s brilliant. 

Craig: But then there’s this shower flashback, which also was wild, and this is, this is the big expedition dump, right? Like- Yeah … this is a whole story. Ah, you should tell it.

Todd: Yeah. Well, she looks up at the shower head and it reminds her of rain, and it reminds her of rain coming down onto a windshield, and it turns out this is the night that she and her mother had the accident where her mother died. They are basically on that bridge. I don’t know how they end, end up getting stuck- Well, 

Craig: her mother is- 

Todd: She’s drunk

her 

Craig: mom is drunk. 

Todd: Yeah, she’s drunk, and that, that gets established. 

Craig: She’s not only drunk, but she’s also th- clearly very agitated and upset. 

Todd: Mm-hmm. 

Craig: I, I think she’s just not paying attention. But what happens is, is wild. Like, you know, we’ve seen this whole drawbridge thing before, but when she goes up over it, she manages to straddle it- 

Clip: Mm-hmm

Craig: with the car as it’s continuing to go up. And again, they must have had some budget for this, ’cause it- Yeah … looked really good. I think they had to have dropped that car or a car more than once, because if I… They, they show it falling into the water several times in sequence But I think the first few times they show it, it lands on its top, and then the last time it lands right side up.

But they sink into the water, and the water’s coming in, and the mom is pinned in there somehow. I couldn’t really tell how 

Todd: She was like, um, something was stabbed through her. At least we find that out 

Craig: later. Through her leg or something. Yeah. But she tells Virginia to get out, and Virginia’s scared or whatever, but eventually she does.

And in coming up, she hit her head. Like, she came up underneath, like, a huge barge- 

Todd: Yeah … 

Craig: and hit her head on the barge, and so that’s the source of her injury. Brain 

Todd: injury, yeah. Oh, it’s so nuts. 

Craig: It is nuts. And, and it looked… I mean, that was a, that was a pretty heavy action piece. There’s a lot going on there.

But she wakes up kind of sitting on the floor outside of the bath, and the curtain is drawn, and she seems kind of confused, and then she opens the curtain and Anne is in there dead, drowned, having drowned, so. 

Todd: Yeah. So she looks at Anne, it cuts to her, and then it cuts back to the body, and it doesn’t look like Anne.

I don’t know if that was just a poor dummy that they subbed in or if that was supposed to mean something, but it was super confusing, ’cause it doesn’t look like Anne at all. 

Craig: And you just, you see her so briefly and, and honestly there were several parts. Anne looks, to me, in the movie, looked different depending on her hairstyle, and she wore several different hairstyles.

Mm. So I kinda had trouble tracking her anyway, but This is the part where Dr. David comes over and she’s like, “I killed Anne.” By the way- … the murder of Anne happened in the morning, but, or at noon, but Dr. David doesn’t come over until nighttime. 

Todd: Yeah. 

Craig: But he drags her upstairs and he’s like, “Look, there’s no body.”

And she’s like, “What?” And that’s when they have that intimate scene with the face touching and finger kissing. ‘

Todd: Cause it’s 12:00 now. It’s her birthday. He says, “We’re coming very close, Virginia. We need to find the link between your trauma and your friends, and I think we can figure out what’s going on.”

Craig: Right. Like, what did your f- what did your friends have to do with it? Yeah. Well, I mean, I guess, I guess Dr. David starts to be a little bit more suspicious when, because a detective knocks at the door the next day and says, “Anne So-and-so is missing. Her car is parked right down the street. Her parents said the last place she said she was coming was here.”

And this is when Dr. David was like, “Uh, no, I, I was here all day yesterday and nobody came over.” Mm-hmm. Like, why would you say that? 

Todd: He’s covering for her 

Craig: in 

Todd: some way. 

Craig: Why would he s- yeah. 

Todd: Yeah. That’s when it, I thought- 

Craig: I 

Todd: guess … oh, is he doing something? Yeah, that’s what I thought- Me 

Craig: too … 

Todd: at this moment. 

Craig: And this is where, again, I don’t r- I don’t remember what inspires it this time, but we get the birthday party flashback.

Todd: This is a whole movie of its own, honestly. 

Craig: It is. And it, it really feels like it goes on for, like, 20 minutes. 

Todd: Yeah. 

Craig: The, the mom has set up a birthday party for Virginia, who I think is played by the same actress, but they do a really good job of making her look younger. I don’t know, maybe that girl is a younger sister or something.

But, uh, she’s got this beautiful party set up in a, in a cottage that’s apparently on their property. Had we ever seen that cottage before? 

Todd: It’s so funny because she just mentioned, uh, she wanted to have it at our cottage, and I’m like, “Oh, okay, they have a cottage somewhere.” Later on we realize that the cottage is just literally behind the house, kind of between the cemetery and their house.

Yes. Like- Yes, it is … why do you have a cottage on your pro- you gotta have a cottage somewhere, like, on a lake somewhere for you to retreat to. Why is it in your backyard? It- 

Craig: The mom has set up this elaborate, very girly, very pretty decorated party with a beautiful cake in the middle of this round table and- Oh, she’s got a 

Mr. Beak: dress on and everything.

Craig: The, the mom’s dressed to the nines. The first thing that happens is they get a phone call, and it’s the dad, and the dad says that he’s still out of the country. He’s not gonna make it back. Virginia’s sad, but she doesn’t wanna make her dad feel bad, so when he says, “Are you having fun at your party? Are all your little friends there?”

She’s like, “Yeah.” 

Todd: Everyone’s here. All six of them. 

Craig: Yeah, yes. And then when she hangs up, the mom’s like, “Why did you lie? Why did you say that?” She said, “Well, I didn’t wanna make him feel bad. Uh, he promised he’d throw me a party when he gets back.” Mm-hmm. And he, the mom says, “Your, your dad never follows through.”

And she’s like, “God, where are your little friends?” It’s like they’re like, they’re over an hour late at this point. And Virginia finally breaks down in tears and says, “They’re not coming. Anne’s throwing a party at her house and they’re all going to Anne’s.” And this ticks the mom off for reasons that are unclear at this point.

Todd: Yeah. 

Craig: But she’s like, “Those dirty bastards, they can’t treat me like this anymore. I’m rich now. We’ll show them. If they don’t come to your party, we’ll go to their party.” 

Todd: She’s so over the top. 

Craig: Super, it’s very melodramatic. And, and she drives drunk to this gated house and, and she’s pounding on the gate and saying, “Let us in.

Let us in.” In the rain. It’s pouring 

Todd: down rain. 

Craig: Mm-hmm. 

Todd: Yeah. 

Craig: Um, and somebody, I, I guess a groundskeeper or something, comes to the door and she says, “Get the man of the house.” She used his name, but I don’t know it. Will 

Todd: Thomerson. 

Craig: Yeah. “Get Will Thomerson out here. I’ll- Tell him to tell it to my face that my daughter’s not welcome here or whatever.”

And he’s like, “That’s all in the past. You’ve gotta just let it go.” And he walks away and she says, “They can’t continue to ignore me. I’m rich now and I’m gonna make them pay,” or something I can’t be 

Todd: bought off ever again. 

Craig: Again. 

Todd: What? Yeah. You were like, “What the hell is she talking about?” 

Craig: Right. I know, but it, it, then all of a sudden I’m like, oh my God, th- there is so much intrigue here that we don’t know yet, and surely we’re going to find out.

Right. And we kind of do- … but it’s very strange. Okay, so anyway, the mother’s gonna make them pay. We cut back to present day. Again, for reasons unknown a- at this point at least, Virginia kills Dr. David with a fireplace poker and just- Uh … splashes the walls covered in blood. 

Todd: There is so much blood here.

There is so much blood it’s nuts. Ugh. Apparently the director was, got kind of a reputation for just throwing blood around the set for some of these scenes- Uh-huh … to the point where, like, the crew was like, “Hey man, you’re getting it on our, on our lenses and stuff. Somebody needs to slow this guy down.”

This is gruesome, yeah. I mean, they just made up for the fact that it didn’t really show the bludgeoning- 

Craig: Right … 

Todd: uh, much by splashing blood everywhere, so. 

Craig: Here’s where things get wild. The dad gets home. He finds all the blood in the house and he’s like, “No, not my baby, not my baby.” He runs out, I guess, looking for Virginia at the wife’s grave.

He sees somebody standing there, but when he turns her around, it’s one of the pretty friends that’s, was around sometimes but didn’t really have much of a story. Yeah. And this part was very confusing to me because she didn’t look dead. 

Todd: No. Was she dead? 

Craig: I don’t know what was happening. She was just standing there and she didn’t say anything.

Todd: Uh, yeah. 

Craig: She must have been dead. I don’t know. 

Todd: I guess. They, we don’t see her again. 

Craig: I don’t know. I don’t, I don’t remember. He also finds somebody’s dug up the mom. 

Todd: Yeah. 

Craig: So he looks around, he sees the, the light is on in the cottage. 

Todd: He also finds the body of the doctor there as well. 

Craig: Yes. Right. Right Oh, boy.

So no bueno. So he walks up to the cottage. He walks into the room. That, this was some great expectation shit where- … apparently nobody had touched that room since the night of the party. Right. And so, like, it’s all still set up with the cake, like, rotting on the table, and the, the decorations are all, you know, covered in cobwebs and stuff.

And all of her friends and her decomposed mother are sat in the chairs around the table, and he’s standing there in horror and she, Virginia, comes walking out of, I don’t know, another room, the kitchen presumably, in a, a nice pretty dress and carrying a cake singing Happy Birthday to Me. 

Todd: Mm-hmm. Oh, I loved it.

I loved it. She says, uh, “Daddy, you kept your promise to me. You came to my birthday party.” That was the motif, right? Was that he wasn’t reliable, he never showed up. Uh-huh. He actually came with packages this time. He was actually there. So I mean, it’s a pretty tragic little moment, and I really felt for this father, and I was also surprised because she was, like, the obvious villain.

I didn’t think she would end up being the villain, but here she is. But it makes sense. We’ve seen so many of these horror movies end this way. 

Craig: Yes. 

Todd: The traumatized person recreates the scene that they were traumatized by and, and in this horrible way, sets up the party with all the dead people. I mean, it’s so typical.

And he just, he just collapses, and he’s just got his head in his hands. And I’m looking at the time and I’m like, “There are 10 minutes left in this movie. W- how long are the credits?” 

Craig: Right. 

Todd: And it’s quite a cake, and she blows out the cake, and then she’s like, “Daddy, would you like a slice? Do you want a big slice or a little slice?”

And he’s just head in hands, looks up, and she spins around suddenly with a knife and slashes his throat as well. Oh, okay. And then she puts the knife down, turns to a person whose body we, I guess we didn’t see earlier, but the head is down on the table and says, “Now it’s time for you, bitch,” lifts her head up, and it’s also her.

Clip: Yes. 

Todd: And I’m like, “Oh my God, are we in, like, initiation, the initiation territory here? We’ve got a twin situation?” W- I, I… My mind is rushing on overdrive trying to sort this out. How could there be a twin in the mix here? Was the psychiatrist working with somebody else? Was this girl hidden? Was she switching back and forth?

Was one at the school and one at home, and were we tricked this whole time? I’m waiting for the flashback scenes to make this clear. 

Craig: Mm-hmm. 

Todd: And then the one who’s sitting down comes to And she sees the other girl, and she gets confused, and they have a little tussle. She reaches over to her and she pulls a mask off of her face, like in Scooby-Doo fashion- 

Clip: Uh-huh

Todd: and reveals that it’s not her face underneath there. It’s her friend Anne. And I was, like, on the floor dying at this point. 

Clip: I… 

Craig: Me too. Me too. Yeah, it was wild. ‘Cause I, like, in my notes I’m like, “Evil twin?” 

Todd: And then you’re like- 

Craig: Anne in a mask? What is happening? 

Todd: Did not see that coming. And Anne has to explain it all because otherwise we would have no idea what’s going on.

Craig: I’m not entirely sure I still know, but Anne feels wronged. 

Todd: Yeah. Because I think, and, and again, I think, you remember Kevin Williamson, when he went to Hollywood and he wrote the script for Scream, he went and decided he wanted to write a horror movie, and he went and watched a whole bunch of old horror movies.

I guarantee you he watched this movie and cribbed directly from it because this is essentially the Scream motivation. 

Craig: Yeah. 

Todd: Your mother was a whore, and she slept with my dad, and she was his mistress, and she broke up our family and ruined our family, and so now I’m getting my revenge on you. 

Craig: And you are his daughter.

Todd: Yes, you’re his daughter. 

Craig: And something like, “And he never let my mom forget that,” or something. I’m like, “What? What are you talking…” So, like, it, it ruined her family and ruined her life and- 

Todd: Now she’s also her daughter … 

Craig: yeah, and they are, like, biological sisters. But so why did she have to kill all of her other friends?

Todd: I don’t know. It’s the same problem with Scream, right? Like, why did they kill all those people when they really had the problem with just her? Ugh. 

Craig: Yeah. 

Todd: It’s hilarious. 

Craig: They struggle briefly, like, for a couple of seconds, and there’s a knife. They’re struggling over a knife. Ultimately, quickly, Anne gets stabbed in the struggle right as the detective is walking in.

And he looks at Virginia and says, “What have you done?” And she just starts singing Happy Birthday to me. And that’s the end. 

Todd: So not only have we had this, like, triple twist with a mask being pulled off and all this shit, but she’s gonna end up being blamed for everything. 

Craig: Anyway. 

Todd: Anyway. 

Craig: Yeah. And like, and like- Oh

three quar- Oh, so I read that it was like they were three-quarters of the way through filming the movie when the actress who plays Anne was told, “We’re changing the ending. You’re gonna be the killer now.” Like, and she didn’t even know that. 

Todd: She was supposed to die, yeah, along with everybody else, 

Craig: so. Yes, along with everybody else.

And, and what it was supposed to be was that Virginia was periodically kind of being possessed by the spirit of her mother, and this was her mother’s revenge. And ultimately, I guess, they decided that there were too many other scripts floating around that were somewhat similar in nature, and so they decided at the last minute to change it.

So that meant that there really were no clues for what the ultimate ending ended up being. Mm-hmm. There’s one point in the very beginning right after the car jump over the bridge where Anne looks at her ominously. That’s it. That’s the only indication. Well, and, and when she explains, when Anne explains what has happened, they walk us through the whole thing.

Yeah. We, we see how Anne pulled off every murder, at least to some extent. 

Todd: It was just chloroform everywhere. Movie- 

Craig: Yes … 

Todd: movie chloroform. Virginia is there. She screams and walks past Anne, who sticks her arm out and smashes chloroform on her face like three or four times to put her out, so then she kills the person and then leaves Anne there to wake up.

Ugh. 

Craig: Yeah, 

Todd: right. I mean, not Anne. Leaves, uh, Virginia- Virginia … there to 

Craig: wake up. Leaves Virginia there to wake up. Yeah. Right. And that’s why she’s always confused and doesn’t know. Now, the, the… I think that… I, I, I don’t think that they were wrong. I think that the being possessed by Mom thing- 

Todd: Yeah, that’d be dumb

Craig: I mean, these… I, I guess. I mean, it, it’s- It’d be okay, but … it’s no more cliche. It’d be fine, but I, I, I don’t think that they were wrong to maybe try something different. But it, it ends up being a little bit clunky. But I feel like I see the remnants of what it was supposed to be early on in the movie, especially more than once, but especially with the whole Virginia seducing Steve at the dance- No

and at her house. 

Todd: The moments where 

Craig: she- That se- … seems 

Todd: to be, like, a different person, doesn’t she? 

Craig: Right. Her behavior was so out of character for her in those scenes that it would’ve made sense to me. But it also just crossed my mind that maybe, ’cause we’ve seen this several times before, that maybe she was just disassociating.

Like, maybe she had dissociative personality disorder or- Right … something like that. So her, you know, actual consciousness wasn’t aware of what her other personality was doing, and that would’ve tracked with the brain injury and stuff, but- 

Todd: Well, also, it could also have been Anne in her disguise at those moments 

Craig: Oh, that’s true 

Todd: It could have been.

I mean- 

Craig: But I don’t think it was 

Todd: No Because I- But I don’t know. If you w- kinda went back and played it out, it’s possible, I suppose 

Craig: I would wanna go back and look at the Steve scene because I’m… If I remember correctly, she chloroformed Virginia after Virginia had already prepared the kebabs. 

Todd: Oh. 

Craig: And then she just took advantage of that.

Oh, yeah. It’s like, I’m pretty sure- She was walking 

Todd: out with the kebabs or whatever, yeah. 

Craig: Uh-huh. Mm. Yeah. So anyway, whatever. It is what it is. 

Todd: Well, think about it though, Craig. They filmed all of this with Virginia being the killer until later on they decided they were gonna make it Anne being in disguise.

If they had just stuck with that, you have a, a big anomaly of a movie, which is what this movie seemed to be at first, where halfway through suddenly the killer’s just shown to us. 

Craig: Mm-hmm. 

Todd: Like, halfway through suddenly we see Virginia literally killing people. 

Craig: Right. That’s right. 

Todd: Like, that’s very different.

And so as the movie was going on and that started happening, you know, I thought again, like, “My God, this is so different from how these movies usually go. What is that twist gonna be?” So- 

Mr. Beak: Mm-hmm … 

Todd: in a way, they corrected it into something, I think, better than what they originally had. And it’s, it’s convoluted and weird.

It’s a last-minute fumble through some nonsense, but I thought it was fun in its ridiculousness. And I loved that last- Yeah. 

Craig: Oh, I do too 

Todd: I love that last dig at the end where it’s like, then she’s gonna get blamed for all this shit? Like, can you make this more bleak? 

Craig: True. Right, right, right. 

Todd: Oh, satisfying.

Craig: Yeah. 

Todd: Ultimately it was worth it for me. I, I, I really enjoyed this mo- I… As I was watching this movie, I didn’t think I would come to the end of it and have enjoyed it as much as I ended up enjoying it by the end. Again, like you said, I really thought it was well made, I thought it was well shot. The whole time through I was very conscious of, you know, this is a step above, and it’s ki- it’s intriguing and it’s got a lot of stuff in there and I’m curious about what’s going on, but it is kind of plodding a little bit and these red herrings are a little obvious and they’re kinda getting in the way.

I mean, be a little respectful of my time here, you know? Can we tighten this up a little bit? 

Craig: Yeah. 

Todd: But man, by the end of it I was like, “All right,” like, “I’m really glad I saw that. It was fun.” 

Craig: Yeah. I am too. Um, if you wanna… And, and, and I didn’t love it, but there were a lot of things that I really liked about it, and it was a good watch.

I- definitely worth seeing, I think. If you wanna watch it, take my advice and go ahead and splurge. Treat yourself- … and spend 3.50 to rent it. On Prime or somewhere else because I ended up watching it on Tubi, which meant that with all of the ads, it came in at well over two hours. 

Todd: Oh, God. 

Craig: And that just felt…

It, it was too long. 

Todd: God. 

Craig: Yeah, it was, it was a little bit rough, but, but ultimately a good movie, and I’m, I’m really glad we finally got around to doing it. Thank you for the request. It, it really has been on our list for years and years, and so it’s, it’s always nice to get a re- to get a request for one of those movies that we’ve talked about for so long and we’ve just never gotten around to.

It, you know, it gives us a good reason to finally get around to it, and usually we are pleasantly surprised and, and this time I was as well. 

Todd: Absolutely. And just in case you might have noticed, those people who go to our website and, uh, talk to us and send us a little voice message, we tend to fast-track their requests through.

Clip: Yeah. 

Todd: Normally our requests come through our patrons, where people send us requests throughout the, the month and on our patron channel at patreon.com/chainsawpodcast. For just five bucks a month they have access, and, uh, not only do they get access to our complete unedited episodes where these phone calls and a lot of personal stuff about us, complete access to us.

We have a lot of chatter going on behind the scenes. We post minisodes there every now and then, little reviews and things that are going on in our lives. We also have a book club that’s going on. We also will have, uh, from time to time a little poll of those requests that we’ve gotten and have our patrons collectively choose which is the request we’re gonna do next.

So if any of that interests you, go to patreon.com/chainsawpodcast and, uh, join the club for just five bucks a month. I think it’s, I think it’s well worth it. On top of that, you could fast-track your request by going to chainsawhorror.com and just clicking Talk to Us and sending us a message. We’d like that, too.

Anyway, no matter how you send us a message, whether it’s on our Facebook page, our Instagram page, our email addresses, those other channels, we just love hearing from you. If you’ve got a birthday this month, let us know what you did this month. We’d be curious to find out. And then, uh, maybe on your birthday month we can do Bloody Birthday.

Until next time, I am Todd. 

Craig: And I’m Craig. 

Todd: With Two Guys and a Chainsaw.