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There is so much to love about Tai West’s X that we couldn’t help going over time to gush over it. Suffice it to say that we were big fans of this flick that chronicles a group of youngsters heading out into the farmlands to shoot a porno movie and end up getting much more than they bargained for.

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X (2022)

Episode #352, 2 Guys and a Chainsaw

Todd: Hello and welcome to another episode of Two Guys and a Chainsaw. I’m Todd.

Craig: And I’m Craig.

Todd: This week, uh, we are doing a very modern film. Uh, last week we had a pretty classic movie from 1971. This one is 2022’s X. Rated R. By Ty West. Written and directed. 

Craig: That was a really funny… That was a really funny pause.

X. Rated R. 

Todd: Remember when trailers were like that? A couple weeks ago we did a film that you insisted was a porn movie. This movie is a movie about the making of a porn movie that goes awry. In what many would consider the golden age of pornography in the U. S. That actually sounds really silly to say it out loud, but it’s true.

In the 1970s, and uh, this is by Ty West, and I am a big fan of Ty West. I believe we’ve done the Innkeepers on here, haven’t we not? Yeah, we have, 

Craig: but didn’t he also do, um, House of the Devil? House of the Devil, yeah. But you didn’t like that one. 

Todd: No, remember, um, I didn’t initially like it, and then when we, when I re watched it again for the podcast, I realized it was actually quite good, and it was right up my alley, and so I did come around to it, and I, I listened again to that episode recently, just to kind of warm myself up, because I also wasn’t sure if I had revised my opinion on House of the Devil, but I’m here to Set the record straight, and episode number, I don’t know, 250 something.

Haha, bear me out. That, that I, I, I turned out, I, I actually appreciate House of the Devil a lot. Because, it had that 70s vibe. I think I was a little more in the mood for it then. I still maintain it was a slow movie. You kinda had to be in the mood for it. But a lot of 70s horror films were like that. They were very, it was kind of a time of the film auteur.

And I feel like this movie is a bit of a throwback to it. Now you sent me, uh, a screenshot of something that I sent you a year ago when this movie came out. This movie came out in 2022, March ish. And, uh, it was, uh, basically like a new 1970s style slasher movie from Ty West is being compared to Texas Chainsaw Massacre and is a throwback to that era.

I think for sure the film captures that era, and I think there are beats in this movie and aspects of this movie that are clearly trying to cop the 70s. film vibe, but it’s not like House of the Devil. House of the Devil was trying to kind of be like a movie from the 70s. I feel like this movie had flashes of it, but this wasn’t like trying to be a movie from the 70s.

It was hearkening back to it. It obviously takes place in the 70s. It was a bit of a nod to it, and definitely a nod. to Texas Chainsaw Massacre and other films of its ilk, but it also had some modern sensibilities in what I would say like the cinematography and the filmmaking style. Yeah, 

Craig: I, you’re right, in that it feels like a modern movie, but I just think that Ty West Has a really strong sense of style.

Yes, and that’s not to say that his style is always the same I think that he experiments with style and that’s what makes him so interesting house of the devil definitely Felt mostly like you were watching a movie that was made in the 70s This doesn’t it feels like you’re watching a very well made modern movie about that time But also in doing that He just wants to remind you every once 

Todd: in a while.

Yeah, that’s a good way 

Craig: of putting it. That we’re in the 70s stylistically. So, like, the opening, and I may get my terminology wrong because I don’t know the technicalities of filmmaking, but the opening shot is of, like, it could be a shot out of the Texas Chainsaw Massacre. It’s just kind of a long shot of a farmhouse.

You know, isolated in this rural environment, um, and it looks like it’s shot on 8mm. Am I, is that right? Like, the film strip that our 

Todd: parents… Yeah, like, well, our parents would shoot on 8mm. Uh, I think a lot of films… Like, for cinema, we’re at least 16mm. There was hardly anything shot on 8. So you’re probably thinking more like 16, 

Craig: but yeah.

Right, but like, it’s like a square. Mm hmm. It’s framed like a square. Yeah. And I thought, the initial image, I’m like, Oh, it’s old school, it’s old fashioned, this is what we’re getting. But then, it zooms in and you realize that it’s not that film. He’s just framed the shot from inside a barn. So those are the barn doors framing it that way.

Yeah, it’s a cool trick. It’s really, really cool, and, and he does that in other places too, not, well, I mean, he does do the framing thing again in other places, but he does other things that just kind of remind you, this is 70s, this is a different time, stylistically. Yeah. I just think it’s so clever. I’m so excited to talk about this movie because I think it’s so good.

I just think it’s such a good movie. 

Todd: It is. It kind of hits on every level, and I just have to say, based on my experience so far, we’ve done two, well we did House of the Devil, we did The Innkeepers, and I believe we also did The Sacrament. Am I right? I know I’ve at least seen The Sacrament. I don’t know if we covered it on our podcast.

Craig: Was it the one? I don’t, no, I don’t know. 

Todd: I don’t know, what is it? That was the one, it’s like, it’s like a found footage film that’s about sort of this weird Christian esque cult, uh, like in the Philippines, and uh, things kind of go horribly wrong. 

Craig: Oh, oh, it’s like a Jim Jones thing. Yeah. Like, yeah, drinking the Kool Aid.

I don’t remember if we did it either. I’ve watched it several times. I didn’t even remember that that was, I didn’t remember that that was a Ty West film. 

Todd: Yeah, he’s just brilliant. Honestly, brilliant. He’s, yeah, he’s really, 

Craig: really good. 

Todd: I honestly don’t have a bad thing to say about any of his films that I’ve seen so far.

And he’s done a little outside of horror. I haven’t seen that stuff. He took a little break for a while and did some television stuff. Or he did like some episodes of the Scream series and some other series. The sacrament, didn’t that come out of a segment in VHS, uh, VHS or something? 

Craig: Uh, I don’t know about that.

He at 

Todd: least did a segment of one of the VHS ones. And we’ve talked about it before, that him and Adam Wingard seem to kind of like, be of the same school in a way, and they’re clearly friends, and they… Seem to help each other out and even act and and write for each other in each other’s movies And and and I am also a major fan of Adam Wingard.

I’ve really come around on him I kind of like Ty West better, but I don’t know I I just like I I just loved every minute of this movie I 

Craig: know because it’s so good and not only like just watching it if I knew nothing else about it I would watch it and say wow, that was great. Like the cinematography is good the acting It’s fantastic.

Like, it’s so good. It’s so, so good. And compelling! Like… These people, this centers around a group of, I mean, let’s just put it out there, pornographers. Like, the producer, I guess, the director, and the performers. And that, I think, just, I guess, I shouldn’t say for other people, but for me, you say that, and I think, oh, seedy.

You know, like, these are kind of seedy people. And the movie just totally flips that on its head, and that’s the one of the things that I love the most about it. These are… Oh my god, I might cry about it. Uh, these are, these are, uh, good, decent people. Yeah, just trying to make some money. Right, and you’re interested in them, and you’re…

Oh my gosh, I was just captivated. I don’t, I don’t know where to start. 

Todd: I mean, it’s, it was obvious and this is, you know, you can so take the easy route on this thing and you can really make this a Sort of paint by numbers movie and follow a lot of tropes. These people go out Onto a farm that they’ve rented to do a porn movie in the 70s, which, like I said, was sort of a heyday of porn, where probably anyone with some money and a 60mm camera could go out, shoot people having sex, and have a fair chance at getting a decent enough distribution to make a lot of money out of it.

And so… I, do I really want to go on record and say I’m kind of jealous that I wasn’t born in this time period? Just like I’ve, you know, like, when we talked earlier about movies, about some of the horror movies that we do, and about how the early 80s and mid 80s were a golden age for VHS, you know? And uh, exploitation films, horror films, like, you talk to producers of this era, and they’re like, we could not put this stuff out fast enough.

Right. That is how. Hungry the market was and how much money there was to be made in even dress. Oh, yeah. Could sell because the rental market was booming and stuff you could put out that would be sellable on VHS you would make money from and so I feel like in a similar way this was a similar age for pornography and you could take the easy way out and be like Oh, these are like dirty, seedy people who are taking advantage of women, who are cajoling them into doing things that they’re not particularly comfortable with, but some of them are drug addicts and they need money, or some of them are whatever, you know, like, you could go all these sort of stereotypical ways, but like you just said, that is not what this is at all.

No. This is a bunch of normal, fine, fun people who are just… Happy and free who are gonna go out and make a movie and the dude financing it is not this like Hair slicked back, you know, New York mafia connected dick. No, he’s a little slick, but he’s a nice guy He’s a good guy. Yeah, he comes across. It’s like this, Texas boy with money kind of thing, but he’s young.

He’s nice he’s He plays the role of a good producer, who’s just like, I’m here to make everybody comfortable, and help keep everybody happy, so that we can make this movie, and I’m gonna like, talk about how much money we’re all gonna make from this, and this is the beginning of everyone’s career, and isn’t this great?

You don’t feel like he’s taking advantage of anybody, and you don’t also feel like anybody in this movie is doing it against their will, everyone is aspiring to greatness. From the writer and director, to his girlfriend assistant, to the few stars in this movie, and him. You just don’t feel sorry for or bad about these people.

And it’s a great way to kick things off. Yeah, I mean, 

Craig: it feels like an… Fun. You, you, you, yeah, well, I mean you alluded to the nasty underbelly of the adult industry in which Historically there has been, and surely even today there is, you know, uh, It existed, 

Todd: and probably still does, like, let’s not, let’s not paint over that.

Let’s definitely… 

Craig: Right, where, you know, people are taken advantage of and abused, and I’m sure that that did happen in the industry, I’m sure it continues to happen in the industry, but… This just is a different side of it that I’m sure also exists, and I, like, I just, I almost enjoyed hearing about it.

There is a conversation in the middle of the movie that I am just going to insist that you play in full, because I was so taken aback by it. And I said before, when we were talking about that porny lesbian vampire movie, I said, I support sex workers, and I do. People who are in it… You know of their own free will and and who are comfortable with what they do like Good for you, you know.

Right. And, and that’s what this seems like. Anyway, but, that’s, uh, It’s almost beside the point, except for that it’s not. That’s why I was so into this movie. Right. It was because of the characters. Now, it is a slasher movie. You’re rooting And that’s, you’re absolutely right. It could have been so easy to make these seedy people, and then we would relish.

Seeing them being tortured and killed. 

Todd: Isn’t that generally the form of it? Yes. Like, we literally talked about Like, last week, clearly the movie was setting up a bunch of horrible people that we would take delight and glee in seeing die. Right. 

Craig: And we’ve said it, it may have been a while, but, you know, we’ve said it a bunch of times when we’ve watched slasher movies.

It’s just a bunch of assholes. You know, like, okay, so here’s this group of assholes and they’re gonna go and get picked off. And that’s fine. That’s fun. We have fun with that. But this, um, is totally different. It’s just… I think, God, there are so many things about this movie that would turn some people off.

Um, the fact that it’s, that pornography is a central part of the story, which it is. Uh, the fact that it is a slasher movie where people are violently killed. Yes, that is true. I can understand why people would object on those levels, but… Beyond that, this is just a movie that everybody should see, just because it’s a really good movie.

Like, I, I want Rick, I want my mom to watch this. Like, mom, mom, mom, it’s a really good movie. I know, I know. I know. They’re porn actors. I know it’s a slasher. I’m telling you, it’s a, it’s a really good movie. Yeah, I mean, you already set it up. I mean, this is exactly what it is. Uh, this, this group of folks, well, I guess there’s, there’s a bookend.

It opens on the shot of this country house, and it looks like it’s the old film, but it’s not, and you see what appears to be the local sheriff walking by a body. It’s covered with something, but what is obviously a body, and a huge body. Yeah. Yeah. pile of blood and Blood and carnage just everywhere leading all the way up to the front door and you see again They’re covered but more bodies inside like it’s a This terrible scene and then of a crime.

Yeah. Yeah the deputy I mean it feels very much like Texas Chainsaw Massacre. That’s how Texas Chainsaw Massacre opens, right? Mm hmm, like the reporters going through the house and stuff feels very much like that The deputy is like hey sheriff you need to come see this and he leads him down to the basement and whatever he sees is shocking to him, but we don’t see it.


Todd: so annoying. And then, 

Craig: right, I know. And then we cut to, uh, 24 hours earlier in a different place, and the main character, Maxine, is sitting backstage somewhere in front of, you know, a lit mirror. Yeah, like a dressing room. Like a dressing room, and, and she, she snorts. It’s a line of coke, she looks, I mean, she’s got the Farrah Fawcett hair and, um, pretty heavy makeup, scantily dressed, so you get a sense of, you know, where we are.

And uh, her boyfriend, who it also turns out is this producer. Comes in and talks to her and said she looks herself in the mirror and says you’re a f ing sex symbol And she does this several times. Yeah, I could talk for the next hour about Mia Goth this girl Came out of nowhere for me and has blown me away now, um spoiler alert We’re doing this movie because I desperately desperately wanted to do it and also because I’ve already seen The prequel and we’re gonna be doing that too.

Yeah, Mia goth is Amazing. I don’t know a whole lot about her but I I feel like she is a real up and coming star and as Great as she is in this movie Todd Just f ing wait. Just 

Todd: wait. Wait till 

Craig: Pearl, huh? Mhmm. Uh, she’s so good. But everybody in this movie is good. So, it’s her. She’s Maxine, and then her boyfriend, Wayne, is played by a guy named Martin Henderson.

He’s been in a bunch of stuff. And then the other actress is Bobbie Lynn, played by Brittany Snow. I really am a big fan of Brittany Snow. I’ve never seen her in anything that I didn’t enjoy her in. She started out in TV, in this show that was like about 1950s Americana, because she is, uh… Just the picture perfect American girl, blonde hair, blue eyes, beautiful.

As it turns out, also a really good actress. She was in the Pitch Perfect movies. Thought she was great in those movies! And then there’s RJ, who is… The camera man. He’s played by a guy named Owen Campbell, his shy girlfriend, who’s also the boom operator. , right. Lorraine played by Jenna, art Ortega, who is like the it girl of the moment right now, right?

Yeah. She is all over the place. Um, this is just, I think just before she broke out into huge stardom and now, you know, she’s a, a huge star. And then the actor. In their film to be, uh, is Jackson played by Kid Cudi, who’s a rapper. I don’t know anything about his music, but he’s very handsome and he does a really good job in this movie, uh, as far as acting is concerned.

And they are going off, as you said, to this farm where they’ve rented like a guest house, I 

Todd: guess. Like a guest house back in the fields behind the farmhouse. 

Craig: Right, and they’re going to film a movie called The Farmer’s Daughters. 

Todd: Yeah. And they’re super excited about it. And, and the movie, it really does, like, you don’t even need to be told, you don’t even need…

I mean, if you’re at all familiar with Texas Chainsaw Massacre, it almost beat for beat in the beginning is kind of like, kind of similar. They go off to a gas station, and they go inside, and they pick up things, and there’s a woman there, and they, there’s a TV playing that, there’s this preacher still on TV, sort of going on and on about sin, and about sex, and pornography, yeah, I mean it’s, That bit’s a bit on the nose and then they move past an accident with a cow in the road where there’s this cow That’s just been completely hit by a truck and it’s it’s it’s pretty gross all these sort of portend what might what will be coming but then they pull up this huge farmhouse and Wayne goes up and knocks on the door and Instantly is met by this older guy who it takes a while for us to see his face In fact, it’s almost not toward Until toward about the end of the movie that we actually get a clear look at this guy’s face.

Um, he’s kept fairly mysterious, but he’s this old, very slow moving guy with a giant rifle. You from 

Craig: the county? This is private property. Didn’t you see the signs down at the end of the drive? Oh, easy, partner. Yo, trespassing. And the law says I can shoot. Sir, I ain’t from the county. I’m from Houston. Yo, we spoke on Tuesday.

You remember? About y’all’s boarding house. Oh, that’s right. You’re looking for a place to stay.

You never can be too careful with strangers. 

Todd: But instantly, this man is sort of put off as a little weird and sinister because he moves slow, he kind of stops and coughs, and they say, are you okay, are you alright, and then suddenly he’ll just like, jump up and be like, I’m fine, and keep moving along. And 

Craig: Ty West is intentional.

at not showing us his face. It’s not like It’s so maddening. It’s very, very intentional that he’s shot from mostly behind or it cuts away Right. Um, and you do eventually see more of his face. I guess you see most of it but it’s almost always in the dark and even from the very very beginning and then throughout, there’s just something Yeah.

Todd: It feels a little sinister. Yeah. I remember the 

Craig: first time I watched it, both him and the old woman, because eventually he does, he’s like, oh yeah, I remember you, and he takes them down, uh, to the cottage, but before they go down there, Um, Maxine looks up and sees an old woman, and watching them from the second story, and you don’t see her much either, only from behind or like through the curtains from a distance.

Um, eventually you do see more of her, and I remember the first time watching this, I was squinting my eyes, like, What’s going on with, who are these people? Because something just, something doesn’t look right. What were you, I mean, were you, were you 

Todd: thinking that? Oh, of course. He’s very much setting these people up to be sinister villains.

And it’s very intentional because the rug is pulled out from under us a little bit later on. It’s, it’s a classic setup of these city slickers come into a countryside where they’re a bit out of water and they don’t really understand and know the culture or whatever. You know, they’re in a place where they’re more or less not welcome.

I mean, even though he leads them down there and stuff, he has a very brief conversation with these folks and then immediately says, I don’t like you guys. Right. 

Craig: And, and my wife is around, so… Like, lay off her. Use, use your discretion. He, he basically tells them to be discreet. Mm hmm. I, I think he has some sense that there’s gonna be some funny business going on.

Now, I don’t… know. No, I don’t know if he, I don’t, I don’t think he’s like, Oh my goodness, they’re getting ready to shoot a porn hero. No. I don’t even know if he knows that that’s necessarily even a thing. thing, but here’s a bunch of sexy people, you know, scantily clad and what he knows there may be some funny.

So he tells them to be discreet. We know they’re going to be making a dirty movie. Um, but, from the very beginning, there’s talk about it, because Lorraine, uh, who, uh, the producer guy always calls Churchmouse, cause she doesn’t, she’s so quiet, and she just kind of, you know, watches everything. Um, she’s really skeptical about the film that her boyfriend is shooting, but her boyfriend says…

It is possible to make a good dirty movie and that’s what we’re gonna do. Yeah, and you’re right like this is It’s kind of at the advent of erotica, porn, whatever has been around forever, but this was really kind of the first time that it was easily accessible on home media. You know, like home media period was a brand new.


Todd: it was really not, yeah, it was just barely coming into the scene at this time. I mean, 1979 is when this takes place. It really wasn’t until a few years later that rental stores were opening up and VCRs were more affordable. The whole Betamax and VHS thing was going back and forth. Ultimately, these people are hoping, you know, to print their movie and show it in theaters and get distribution and then go on and do more.

Yeah. Um, and I think one of them mentioned something about, I predict that, you know, people will be able to get it in their homes real 

Craig: soon. Uh huh. And it’s gonna blow up. 

Todd: It’s gonna blow up. Like, actually, it’s quite prescient in that. They’re on the right track, honestly. 

Craig: Well, right, and that’s what I was gonna say, like, this guy is…

A filmmaker and he says at some point you got to start somewhere and a lot of the people that we have talked about on this podcast Started in this yeah started or at some point Dabbled in this industry because it was work. You know, it was Camera work it was getting your foot in the door It was meeting people and and learning stuff and and there were people like RJ this guy who wanted to Who really were filmmakers.

Yes, non simulated sex was part of the movies that they were making, but they were making movies. Uh, and I, it’s not important to the plot necessarily, but I just appreciate, I don’t know, it feels really character driven. Yeah. Because at its core… It is a slasher movie and we get there that, you know, these old people are crazy and they are going to kill them.

Yeah. But there’s so much more to it. Like that’s, it seems like, okay, this is a slasher movie. So that’s what you expect. It to orbit around and I guess in a way that it does but that’s the least of what I care about in this movie 

Todd: Yeah, it’s very surprising. I mean some of the things that happen in this movie will genuinely surprise you I mean, I guess once again, it should be obvious but like if you’re interested in seeing this movie like I think it’s better if you go if you go and watch it and Don’t listen to what we have to say about it first because they’re just Little moments.

Not like major plot twists, but kind of some things that catch you off guard that are really clever and really smart and really kind of rip you a little bit emotionally in this film. And, uh, and that’s the genius behind it. I was looking for reasons, because I’m so programmed, you know, in slasher movies, to find reasons for people to get offed.

To find the, the bad in these people we know are gonna get killed, like, I was, I was waiting to see what a sleazeball R. J. and Wayne really were, you know? Or how selfish they were, or whatever, but it, it never happens, like, you’re like, no, these are like, cool people, they don’t deserve to die, and That alone is pretty unique for a slasher movie, honestly.

Especially one that deals so openly with sex, where sex is the punishment, you know, for it. R. J. is a guy kinda like me, like, you know, well, you gotta start somewhere, and, uh, you really wanna be a good filmmaker, and you’re getting your foot in the door, and even though he knows he’s making some porn movie, he’s gonna try to make something real out of it, right?

He’s got his art. And, and, uh, Wayne, he’s, you know, he’s like, we’re gonna make a lot of money from this. It’s gonna be the start of everything. He’s encouraging these other people. Like you said, Maxine is constantly looking in the mirror and telling, encouraging herself. You can do this. You’re a star. Bobby Lynn is kind of full, more or less full of self confidence already, right?


Craig: Lynn likes That’s 

Todd: what, I, I like… She’s a stripper, right? Like, 

Craig: I mean… I think she’s a stripper, but… It’s never explicit, but… I don’t get the sense that… It seems that they were working in a strip club. That’s where they came from. That’s what it looks like. But, it doesn’t seem like this is Bobby Lynn’s first…

Go around right? She knows what she’s doing because they do I mean as soon as they get like literally as soon as they get Settled in they film a sex scene and it’s relatively Graphic as far as sex scenes are concerned Mm hmm, but it’s just And like it’s obvious that they’re shooting a porno and there’s, there’s one point the, the RJ, the, the cameraman is directing them and like he tells them to change position and he’s talking to them and stuff.

And Jackson eventually says, yo dude, just shoot it and stay in your lane. And Bobby Lynn starts laughing. Until she remembers that the camera’s still on and then she goes right back into the porny moaning, like she knows, she knows, she knows exactly what she’s doing, so I don’t get the sense that this is her first time, and I also get the sense that she enjoys her work, and I just, like, I love that about her character, she is, she’s a beautiful, stunningly gorgeous woman who Likes sex, who is comfortable with the person that she is performing with.

It’s her boyfriend, um, that she’s performing with. She’s straight up set, like she can’t wait to get started, like. Yeah. They find, when they arrive, they’re like, we’re here, and she’s like, finally, I’m so horny, like. She, she likes her work, and you just don’t, I hope, I honest to God hope, that the majority of the people who work in the sex industry enjoy their work.

Um, and I believe that a lot of them do. Now, Britney Snow, you know, these, all of these people are legitimate actors, and Yeah, 

Todd: it’s kind of surprising. 

Craig: It, it is. Uh, I, I honestly think that because Britney Snow was introduced to the world in such a way. I don’t know. It was her show was called like American dreams or something.

And she was so the all American girl. I think that she’s kind of been trying to break free of that mold throughout her career. But she was asked in an interview about filming these nude scenes in which she is very nude. Yeah. And it, it’s pretty, you know, like, it’s of course all simulated, but it is graphic.

Um, and she said, and this makes so much sense to me, and I love it, I think there was a lot of confidence in terms of our characters, and part of the nudity came from that confidence that our characters exuded. It almost felt necessary, because not, Not only were we filming a porn, but our characters would have been so comfortable with that.

Uh, Snow said the film was an exercise in me feeling confident about my body. I was pretty proud of myself. Yes! Like, yes! Be 

Todd: proud! That is 

Craig: fantastic! I just love that attitude. Like, these people would have been comfortable. I need to exude that in my performance, and I’m proud of what I did. Good! for you, and all of them should be proud because this is a great movie.


Todd: fantastic. Good characters, great movie. While they’re banging, Maxine goes on a walk, and she finds like a bit of a, like a lake, or a little, more like a pond, and sits down on this dock, and in the background, immediately we start seeing this. It’s a figure. It’s clearly not the man, and we figure it’s probably the wife because we did see the wife peeking out at them in a sort of sinister way, you know, through the window as they pulled in.

And this is where the filmmaking gets, the filmmaking itself of the movie gets a little 70s in style. Um, like you said, it’s like, it’s like he switches to it every now and then. Uh, there’s one, one of the hallmarks of that 70s style, which we talked about many times on this podcast, but like, I mean, even two weeks ago, Vampire Rose Lesbos, like the zoom.

Of the camera, the pull in, the pull out, that kind of thing. This happens, she’s on the lake and suddenly the camera pulls out from her and zooms in and all that. And she goes swimming. She goes skinny dipping. Which is a very, you know, it’s a very slasher movie kind of thing to do. We’re waiting for something bad to happen to her as soon as somebody goes skinny dipping.

And, but they’re just super great camera angles. And it, and Taiwa, he sets up… Shots that have payoffs later. He has this shot She strips down and of course there’s a POV of this mysterious figure in the woods kind of watching her Strip down and jump in the lake and then there’s this extreme high angle view straight down on her With a huge expanse of the lake and the dock sort of just swimming out into the middle and it’s it’s gorgeous It looks great, you know, and then it comes back to this shot again where she’s just floating there You know in the water the at the same time he does these really interesting flash cuts which I’ve really only seen and Sort of like Grindhouse y or Artsy type movies, right?

Where it cuts to a sh what’s supposed to be the next scene, but then it cuts back to the previous scene, but then back to the previous scene, and then back to the next scene, and then back Like this weird back and forth, it’s very jarring. Yeah, I love that! Just stylistically, it’s great. But then anyway, we kinda go back and forth between, uh, Wayne and RJ and them, and then there’s some flash cuts, and then she’s back in the water, and we see there’s a crocodile.

And this is… I felt like, uh, a reminder that these people are not in their element. You know, city people, and they don’t know what they’re getting into, didn’t think to look for bad things in the water, didn’t imagine there could be a… Cottonmouth snake swimming through here, or a crocodile, or whatever. And, uh, yeah, this crocodile, uh, is there, that we see.

And then from that huge above shot, we see her, she hasn’t seen the crocodile, she’s swimming toward the dock, and this crocodile was just coming after her. And it is so intense. It’s so effective, and of course 

Craig: she And so quiet, like Oh yeah! 

Todd: I love it. Just understated. Like you don’t need to make this intense.

You don’t have to put Jaws type music behind it. Right, right. It speaks for itself. And just before the crocodile gets to her, you know, of course she gets onto the dock, never sees it, uh, and walks away. Anyway, uh, but, but she gets out and she kind of puts her clothes back on and, and later on that woman is back on the porch but Maxine is out in the field and she kind of sees her from a distance and waves at her and this weird woman kind of beckons her.

And this woman is weird. Like, she’s… Old. Like, she is so old and decrepit looking that she, she can hardly move, she’s so slow. And it took a while, I mean, obviously, when I’m watching this I’m thinking, this is obviously a person, old person’s makeup. It was not until almost the end of the movie that I realized that Mia Goth was playing this woman.

I know! The first, I 

Craig: was waiting, like, I was like, does he even know? Yes. Yes. I, I, I didn’t either. I didn’t, I was like, I felt the same way about Howard, her husband. I’m like, this has got to be old age makeup. It’s just too, it’s not exaggerated. It’s not exaggerated to a point where I don’t believe that it could be real.

It’s just, they’re really, really old. 

Todd: People who don’t take care of themselves, like your standard horror movie. This is where it’s got strong Texas chainsaw vibes. Like I’m thinking of. You know, the whole family sittin around the table and especially that old person who doesn’t talk with the kind of insanely old looking makeup on them.

And of course this house that she’s invited into that she goes into is, it’s dirty, there’s crap in the, there’s dishes in the sink. It just seems like these people don’t take great care, but they’ve been there a very, very long time and this house has a history and this couple has a history, you know.

There are, Photos on the wall of them when they were younger and this is the beginning of you kind of beginning to Understand about these people like this couple by the end of the movie They’re not just crazy loony old people who are out to murder folks They get some sympathy they get some backstory, but not initially Initially, he’s setting these guys, these folks up to be sinister monsters, and so it’s a bit of a twist, I think, when later on, we suddenly and almost startlingly realize, yes, they’re doing bad things, but they’re also, like, people with needs and wants.

Well, they 

Craig: are, yeah, they, right, they, they are, they’re people. Arguably. Crazy people. Well, 

Todd: not arguably. They’re definitely crazy. Like, nobody needs to do this, right? But at this point anyway, like, I just love, like, and he does these great intercuts. There’s this moment where she sits down and she has poured her lemonade.

And they’re cutting this with shots of the others in the cabin also drinking. But they’re 

Craig: shooting a scene for the movie. Yes, 

Todd: it’s a movie bit. 

Craig: But it’s so, they’re so parallel. It’s, it’s, it’s great. It’s fun. I love that scene too, that scene where, from The Farmer’s Daughter. Like that, that’s, I, I love that he used that.

That’s like the perfect classic trope of silly video porn. But Britney snow, like, Oh my goodness. I’m afraid we don’t own a telephone, but my daddy will be home soon. And I’m sure he could give you a lift to town. Would you like to come inside? Oh my gosh. Yeah. But she is fantastic doing it. And I don’t want to like.

I was more focused on the women, but Kid Cudi is great. He’s really good in this movie. He is, yeah. He’s really confident in himself, to the point of like, being cocky, 

Todd: but And aloof, in a way. Yeah, but not 

Craig: unlikable. No. I totally liked him, and he and Brittany Snow were like A cute couple who happened to shoot pornography together.

But anyway, yeah, and then, so the old lady is talking to, the old lady, again, also played by Mia Goth. So she’s playing both roles in this scene. But the old lady, you know, like, talks to her. And then as she’s, as they’re going out, because Mia, the… Maxine is obviously like, okay, weird lady. I gotta go. Um, but as they’re walking out, the old lady looks at a picture on the wall.

It’s her wedding picture. Now you can’t see it. He doesn’t angle the camera in such a way that we can see it clearly, but. Spoiler alert, it’s Mia Goth, because she’s playing both, both roles. Um, but she talks and she says, uh, Howard served in both wars. There wasn’t anything he wouldn’t do for me back then.

This is the second time I’ve watched this movie and I didn’t, that totally went right by me the first time around. Um, but It’s significant. There wasn’t anything he wouldn’t do for me back then. Um, and she says she was a dancer, and then while Maxine is looking at the pictures, she reaches out and touches Maxine’s body.

Like, her, her skin on her abdomen. And Maxine kinda, you know, she’s taken aback. She’s like, what are you doing? But then… Howard comes back, and the old lady says, You should, you should leave. It’ll be our little secret. And Maxine’s like, What? Like, What will be our little secret? I don’t know, but then she goes back home, and her boyfriend’s been looking for her, because they’re losing the light, and she’s supposed to film a scene.

And the scene, she sits in front of her mirror, and she does a bump of coke, which, she, she has a coke problem. Yeah, clearly. But she, she does a bump of coke, And she looks herself dead in the eye and says, I will not accept a life. I’d not deserve before she gets up and goes out and enthusiastically films her sex scene with Jackson in the barn that the old lady comes and watches.

Todd: Right. But this is intercut with the old woman in the house. Initially it was, it’s undercut with this old woman in the house, putting on makeup. Yes, and it even gets literal split screen in this which is also kind of a very old You know people don’t do this anymore either unless they’re trying to be cute or retro and at this moment You see this woman putting on this makeup and this was the first moment in the movie where I started to really feel for this Gal because she clearly is Pining for her days of you exactly exactly And she doesn’t have to say it, it just becomes very clear.

And like you said, she sneaks down and she looks in the window and Watches her riding this guy in this sex scene and there’s some interesting editing here 

Craig: It’s not like we’re seeing POV shots We’re either seeing shots of the scene or we’re seeing shots of the old lady watching But then in a moment where we’re seeing One of the scene, Maxine looks back over her shoulder.

It’s suggested to me, though I don’t think that the film actually confirms it. It’s suggested to me that she sees… Yeah. And then in that moment, she becomes, like, all of a sudden, it is the old lady in that sex scene for just like two really short cuts. 

Todd: The implication is almost that the old lady sees herself or imagines herself being there in that moment.

I think it’s 

Craig: about duality, and I think that that’s what ultimately the old lady’s Motivation is is that she’s pining for 

Todd: her youth. She’s full 

Craig: of regret Well, yeah, and and at some point later, she says you don’t deserve I don’t remember But basically what it comes down to is she’s jealous 

Todd: But you know what sudden sympathy like at this moment.

I was like, oh my god. This movie is Really going in a direction I wasn’t expecting. It seems, initially, to be setting these two people up as monsters with sinister intentions. And then you realize the humanity of this woman in this moment. And it totally changes. Things at least for me from here on out for a while.

Craig: It’s not just a faceless Shape going around and killing people. Nobody’s even died yet. 

Todd: No Well, the very next scene I believe is that she’s back in her home the old woman and she approaches The guy her husband and she asks him please and he says no we talked about this. I can’t my heart She’s asking for sex.

Craig: She did right. She does a little sexy dance for him Oh, it’s 

Todd: so sad. It is sad, and like I almost cried, you know, at this moment. Uh, I didn’t Honestly. 

Craig: I didn’t almost cry, but I get it, you know? Like, I I’m not twenty something anymore, you know? I don’t I don’t I don’t look like I did then. I still think I’m a decent looking guy, but, uh, I 

Todd: mean, I, I, I’m, maybe I’m really fatalistic, And I often reflect on, my god, you know, I am going to be old and, and, unable to move around.

I know. eventually die someday, and more so, you know, I think about it more so than obviously anybody ever does in their youth, and, you know, it’s a little spooky to think about, and it was very easy for me to put myself in the position of these people, like, oh my god. Right. 

Craig: That’s what I’m saying. Like, bro, last week I went to the doctor to, like, talk about when I’m gonna have my hip replaced, like, I feel it.

I feel it. Yeah. That’s good. Like it humanizes these people. Now, in saying that, they are also still super creepy. Yeah. Uh, it’s, it’s great. 

Todd: This is the great thing. Is it the core of this movie? It’s still a crazy ass horror movie, right? And so like, he never has pretensions to ultimately trying to make this, this point, but it touches on it.

It’s, it’s great. I just love the balance. That Thai West has here. I 

Craig: know like, oh my God, , this is gonna be 

Todd: a long episode because it is. We’re already 40 minutes in and we still have so much to talk about . We, nobody’s even died 

Craig: yet. I know. Then it cuts to this scene where all of. The characters except for the old people.

So our whole crew sit down in the living room at the end of the day and Lorraine is Curious and says she’s like I I do have a question And she says to she says it to Brittany Snow’s character Bobby Lynn. Isn’t it strange? Watching her doing it with him. It’s just business 

Todd: as long as the 

Craig: camera is running So the camera changes things.

That’s right. It’s not real life, Rainey It’s just a movie. I know that. I’m just saying. What about love? What about love? Well, don’t y’all believe in it? Of course we believe in love. How can you love someone and still be with other people? You think we don’t have no morals or something? Is that it? No, no, I, I, I just…

Take it from me. Letting outdated traditions control how you live your life will get you nowhere. I don’t know about you, but I got better places to be than where I came from. I ain’t a fan of that. Besides, it’s just sex. You can decide who you want to love, not who you want to screw. Attraction is out of our control.

It ain’t healthy keeping those feelings locked away inside. I seen you sneaking a few long peeks at Jackson over here. No, I, I wasn’t looking You don’t mind 

Todd: none. She’s right. I don’t mind. 

Craig: No offense. Everybody likes sex. It’s a gas. We’re just not afraid to admit it. Queer, straight, black, white. It’s all disco.

You know why? Because one day, we’re gonna be too old to fuck. And that. The fact of the truth of the matter is, we

turn folks on. And that scares them. And they can’t look away neither. That’s right. We’re like a foxy car wreck. Mm hmm. Which is how I know that this new home video market is set to explode. Finally, people are gonna get to see what they desire in the privacy of their own homes. Free of judgment. We’re gonna give that to them before anyone else.

Before it ain’t only gonna be for perverts 

Todd: no more. 

Craig: Aw, toast to the perverts. They’ve been 

Todd: paying our bills for years. Hear, hear. To the perverts. 

Craig: For living on live access. Being young and having fun to the day we die, to the power of independent cinema, to living life on our own terms, and never accepting what self-righteous naysayers have to say.

Right on. And I just think that it’s such an interesting conversation. I, I, I, I think that. Nearly everybody, and I’m going to include myself in that, kind of objectifies sex workers and doesn’t think of them as real people. And I think that this movie does a good job of, these are just people. Yeah. They’re people doing a job.

I don’t know, I feel like I’m harping on it, but I just, I think, I find it to be such an interesting element of, What should just be a silly horror movie. But I think it’s an important conversation to have. And I’m so glad that Ty West is having it. Yeah. Right here in front of us. 

Todd: And it’s rooted so much in the context of the film and the era that the story takes place in, you know, this is still part of the free love kind of era where young Americans were becoming more frank about sexuality and starting to question what you might say the more prudish or traditional values of their parents and Religion and all that stuff which you know Even I raised I was raised in a way that like you don’t have sex till you’re married Yes, Todd!

Something for married people who love each other very, very much, and in a way I kind of resent that. Todd! Because 

Craig: I was gonna say the exact same thing, and like, I’ve been debating, like, do I say this out loud? I was gonna say the exact same thing. Like, honestly, the, the, I was raised with such a puritanical view of sex.

Yeah. And I kind of resent it too. Right? Because at this stage in my life… Looking back, I’m like, Damn it. Like,

God, you were only gonna You were only gonna be that young. And good looking once.

It’s so true. Damn 

Todd: it. I know, I know. You know, I didn’t even drink until I was 21 either. And I also similarly look back on that like, all that free booze I missed. I went to the same parties, I just didn’t partake, you know? And uh, and that was a very different way of being, and ultimately I don’t really regret anything.

But, that being said, I sure wish I was raised with a little more, um, you know, less puritanical values, which… I don’t know, we don’t really need to get into the nature of sex on this podcast and our personal views on it necessarily, but suffice it to say that my views have changed considerably since then, now that I’m much older.

And the things that they’re talking about, like you said, I appreciate they’re having this conversation, I like it. It’s very much rooted in the time, and ironically, it’s a conversation we need to be having again, because it almost seems like things are, uh… Uh, I don’t want to say like, careful, I need to be real careful, right?


Craig: that one guy that gets pissed off 

Todd: at us. Yeah, but yeah, screw that guy. And we all have different values and that’s totally fine. Right. But the thing is, let’s explore and let’s be accepting, 

Craig: you know, right. And you, you know, have your ways and. Don’t worry about me. Yeah. Right? Leave me alone. Leave me alone.

You do your thing. I’ll do my thing. It’ll be fine. Yeah. I totally understand what you mean. It’s a way bigger conversation than we have time to talk about. So, let’s take a musical break. Seriously. Now, here at this point in the movie, we have… A musical number, like, which should be so stupid and out of place, but works so well for me.

Now, I could understand if somebody else was like, Why in the middle of this movie does this person take a moment to sing Landslide? But this is 

Todd: also such like a… 60s, 70s, hell, even when I was in college, like this is something that college kids do sometimes, right? Oh, totally. Like somebody’s got a guitar and they break it out and everybody’s super happy to play it and sing along and it feels all folksy 

Craig: and stuff.

Well, and, uh, Brittany Snow can sing, but it’s not like this is, you know, highlighting her musical abilities. It’s just exactly what you said. It’s sitting around in the living room. Somebody’s got a guitar. She sings this song, but Landslide is a great song. And it’s, it’s doing that thing again. It’s doing the split screen between the young people and the old people, particularly the old lady and the song landslide is largely, I think.

Well, I don’t know. I know, uh, Stevie Nicks could tell you what it’s about. But yeah, it seems really appropriate. Like, one of the lines, when it, I noticed that when the camera was specifically on the old lady, one of the lines is, can I handle the seasons of my life? Like, I think that that’s what it’s trying to highlight.

These young people are in a particular season of their life. This older lady’s in a particular season of her life, and I, uh, again, I think it’s just kind of highlighting Her regret and whatnot. I liked it. Ah, it shouldn’t make 

Todd: sense. Yeah She’s back in front of the mirror and she’s wiping off her makeup.

Yeah, it’s sad. It’s super sad I was not expecting this turn, you know, I really wasn’t and Yeah, I mean, it’s it’s just brilliant filmmaking. I was so wrapped up in this story at this point me, 

Craig: too This is such an interesting twist, too. Lorraine says she wants to do a scene, but RJ, her boyfriend, is bothered by it.

And, like, says outright, no, you can’t do that. And Wayne says, whoa, whoa, whoa, don’t get upset. Let’s, let’s take this outside. And he takes him outside, and he tells him, look, She’s gonna do it whether you like it or not. And if you try to stop her from doing it, not only is she gonna do it now, but she’s gonna go out and do it again and again and again.

With who knows who. It’s kind of like saying like, This environment is safe. And RJ says, But she’s, she’s different. She’s a nice girl. Which Wayne takes offense to. As he should. Because the implication is then that Maxine and Bobby Lynn are not nice girls. And he takes offense to that, but he comes up to her, he moves up close to RJ’s I hate to tell you this, but isn’t none of them nice girls?

I just think it’s such an, oh, it’s, it’s just such an interesting take. And that’s not to say that I think that he means that as an insult. It’s just, I think it’s more like your perception of what a nice girl is. This isn’t real and you know, these are, these are women, you know, they’re, they are sexual beings.

Todd: Yeah. It exposes RJ’s hypocrisy because earlier on he was the one telling Lorraine, don’t be such a prude. Lorraine was like, I don’t understand. This was way back earlier in the movie when they were in the van talking about the movie and. And she’s the one saying to him, I’m not sure about this, you know, I’m not sure, like, why are we making this kind of movie and all that?

And he’s like, don’t be a prude. And now that’s getting thrown back in his face. It’s clear he can’t take it. And how interesting is this, right? Oh my god. And also, I felt bad for RJ. I mean, again, he’s being forced to confront what he was Claiming in the beginning that he’s an auteur making this movie and, you know, he’s fine filming all these sex scenes with this other girl and all this stuff, but as soon as his girlfriend wants to be in the mix and has some say in it, he wants to stop her from it.

And honestly, Wayne makes a ton of sense. I thought his advice was fantastic in this particular situation and I gained a lot of respect for him. I mean, this was the point where I realized, yeah, Wayne is actually a pretty good guy too. He’s got a good head on his shoulders. And so, man, that was interesting.

And then, of course, she does. And he films it. The next scene I think we have is Everyone’s asleep, it’s night time, R. J. is awake, he is taking like a cold shower and he is curling up and crying because he is devastated that he just filmed his girlfriend having sex with this other person. And my god, I felt for R.

J. too. 

Craig: No, I did too, and I felt like it was very human. I feel for him because Much like him, I am not that sexually liberated. Like, I would like to think, like, objectively in my mind, I’m like, yeah, you know, sexual autonomy and all that stuff, but if I were in his position where my partner wanted to shoot a porn scene with somebody else, I would again, I would also not.

Well, I don’t think. Um, so, so I totally get it. And I do feel bad for him. And after he cries, um, he decides that he’s, he’s so upset with them, with all of them, that he’s just going to leave. And he’s basically like, well, screw them. I get, you know, they can find their own way home. You’re going to take the whole van.

Yeah. What a day. But he gets in the van and as he’s going to leave, the old lady is angry. in the driveway, like in, in the headlights and on the radio is playing. Don’t fear the reaper, which is so good. And like he gets out, this is the first of several times that this happens, all of their, because they’re decent people, their initial instinct is always.

to help this woman. They, they, they believe that she’s in distress, which she is. I mean, she, she seems like, what is she, what is this old lady doing standing out doors in her nightgown in the middle of the night for no reason. So he goes and like offers to help her back into the house and she embraces him and like moans and tries to kiss him.

And when he pushes her away, she stabs him in the neck. Yes. And then he falls to the ground, grasping at his neck. She straddles him and then continues to stab him repeatedly. And blood sprays all over the headlights. The headlights are lighting the scene, so when the blood sprays, then everything is just lit in blood red as she continues to ravage him.

Oh man. It’s wild. 

Todd: And I mean, the sexual overtones here are bald. Ha ha. They’re, they’re clear as day. I mean, she’s straddling him like earlier, the Maxine was straddling the other person. Of course, always the stabbing and the repeated stabbing. And then she gets up and, uh, does this little dance. Mm hmm. In the red headlights like she is in her world and she is happy and that’s what you know.

Yeah, she’s crazy 

Craig: And she takes the keys and then Lorraine wakes up and and realizes that RJ is gone and she’s worried She thinks that maybe she’s upset him and she tells Wayne and Wayne goes looking for him in the barn Wayne in his little briefs that that was kind of funny to me like just strutting around in these tidy little briefs I mean, I guess…

In, in, in their industry, modesty isn’t really all that important. Um, Lorraine goes up to the house and she finds Howard, the old man, looking for his wife. Meanwhile, back in the barn, Wayne steps on a nail. Oh, God. Which was the most uncomfortable scene of the whole movie for me. Like, you see the nail, you see him walking towards it.

You know it’s gonna happen. And, oh my God, his foot just goes all the way down. on it, and then it’s sticking out of a little piece of board, and that board has just nailed his foot. Ah! And he has to pull it out. And then I think he hears something, and he goes to the far end of the barn, and looks through holes in the, 

Todd: in the wall.

There are like three holes almost deliberately drilled there in the wall, which raised some questions for me. Yeah. 

Craig: I don’t know. But he gets pitchforked through 

Todd: the eye. It’s so Fulchi. It is like, It’s very Fulchi, yeah. Direct ripoff from zombie, uh, But interestingly enough, Again, Tai West, he’s, he’s cool.

He gets pitchforked in the eye real fast, From the side view, And then, immediately it goes back to… The other two, as they’re looking for, the man asks the girl to go down to the basement. And so she goes in the basement, and of course, we’re a little nervous about this because we saw the beginning of the movie.

We know there’s something freaky in the basement, or at least there will be, we’re not sure what. Uh, and then, I don’t know if I’ve ever seen this in a horror movie we’ve done before. It comes back to the kill. Like, it left us in the middle of the kill. It comes back to where it just left us. And where we see him impaled and this pit What is it?

It’s actually a pitchfork. Gets pulled out of his face and his eye drops and he falls to the ground. As he falls to the ground, the woman comes inside with her pitchfork very slowly. pokes and prods at the body to kind of make sure it’s dead and then uses the bitch fork to start putting a little bit of hay on top of him and the whole thing that was going through my head was was this all like a setup because They’ve put holes in the back wall that are perfectly spaced for this three pronged pitchfork.

Craig: I think it was just a coincidence. Really? 

Todd: Yeah. Do three holes exist in the back that this pitchfork fit through perfectly? I don’t know. I don’t know. Anyway. We’re back, 

Craig: we’re back to Lorraine locked in the cellar because he lured her down there. He told her to go find a flashlight down there, which she did, but then he locked her down there.

And so she’s now looking around and she, I don’t remember if we see what she sees. at the same time that she does. But, uh, the, the cover image, uh, of this movie is Jenna Ortega screaming. Um, and this is why, because down in the basement, she finds a, a man, a man’s corpse strung up, like chained to the wall in the basement with his pants down around his ankles, which implies to me that that old lady was like.

Uh, what? Did they like kidnap him and she was like messing with it? So gross. Um, and then, I don’t know if you noticed this, but the very next scene is Jackson taking a carton of milk out of the refrigerator and that man is on the Milk carton. 

Todd: Yep. I did notice that, actually. 

Craig: I didn’t notice it the first time, I only, like, I only noticed it this time, but it suits, like, they cut away from the dead guy to him taking out the milk carton, and there’s a guy on there like, oh, that’s convenient.

But, uh, Howard kind of comes up to the house, and Jackson is the only one awake there, and he offers to help him look for his wife, while totally naked. This was a whole This just felt like a funny joke to like 

Todd: His gong is like hanging down in the You can actually see it in the 

Craig: shadow. It’s so funny. Yeah, it’s hilarious.

Um, but, Jackson’s a he’s a good guy. Like he’s He’s also a vet. He’s a veteran too. And so like he wants to help out his fellow veteran and he’s gonna help him look for his wife And he does and like they they go down to where the pond is and and Jackson says, you know It’s kind of heavy artillery for looking for your wife because the Howard has a shotgun and he’s like well, that’s for alligators, uh, I Found her down by the pond before so they go looking for Her down at the pond and Jackson like is legit looking for her, but then they don’t find him and Meanwhile back at the house the old lady gets naked and gets in bed with Maxine and is caressing her Yeah, it’s disgusting, but then Jackson finds the old man again, and he’s like I couldn’t find your wife and Howard’s like, you’re just the same as the last guy prancing around enticing my wife and then he shoots him.

Now again, like these, these old people, there’s, there’s reason it’s crazy of course, but there is reason behind what they’re doing. He’s angry. He told them, he told them to be discreet if, if they had been discreet and had not enticed his wife. Maybe they would have been left alone, but I still like I hated that I knew I knew Jackson was gonna get killed There was no question in my mind.

Yeah But it’s still I hated it max wakes up the old lady’s in bed with her. So she I I call her Max cause we’re friends. Maxine wakes up and screams cause that old naked lady is in bed with her and that wakes up Bobby Lynn who gets up to see the old lady like fleeing the house naked.

Todd: Oh man. Maxine’s gotta snort some coke to continue to deal with this situation. In the meantime, Lorraine’s in the basement. She’s gotten a hatchet. I gotta step in here too and talk about the sound design a little bit. Yeah. There’s a very interesting score that includes sort of moaning sounds and like 

Craig: almost sexual crying.

In the beginning, right. It becomes more sexual as the movie progresses. I feel like in the beginning, in the opening scenes, it’s… I mean, I guess you could play for comparison, but like, in the beginning, it’s just like, Ah! Ah! Like, it’s just like, kind of like sighing. Um, but then, as the movie progresses, it becomes much more sexual in nature.

And it’s interesting. Well, 

Todd: um… Lorraine is back there, and she’s trying to, uh, hack through the door, which she does. She hacks through the wrong side of the door, honestly. Uh, and reaches through and tries to open the lock, and there’s this crazy jump scare as this guy is back at the house now, and he smashes her hand brutally with the butt of his…

of his, uh, shotgun. And her fingers are just mangled, broken. Yeah, that was bad. 

Craig: It’s horrible. Bobby Lynn tries to help the old lady. The old lady has walked out to the dock, um, and is standing there naked. Bobby Lynn is kind to her, and says, I understand. My grandma used to get confused too. Uh, I, there was even a time when I wanted to be a nurse.

Like, she’s being so kind. And the old lady… 

Todd: Calls her a whore. Yeah, what have you ever done except be a whore? you don’t deserve to flaunt it in my face the way you do and pushes her into the water and Featured to the alligator takes her out. That is so fast and so sudden that I jumped. 

Craig: I knew, no, I knew it I knew that she was gonna feature to the alligator 

Todd: But I didn’t think it would happen that quickly and that suddenly it did shock me holy shit, 

Craig: it’s it’s funny I I don’t think I would have noticed this I read about it Like almost all of the deaths are foreshadowed in some way when they walk out of the strip club at the beginning The, the whole front facade of the strip club is this huge mural, um, and central to it is a, a blonde woman, um, in a bikini and an alligator is pulling at the bottom of her bikini, which foreshadows this death.

And I read, you know, there are specific things that foreshadow lots of the other deaths too. I don’t think I ever would have picked up on it. Clearly some thought was put into that. Um, Max back at the house, the old, both the old people are headed back to the house, so Max hides under the bed, and then the old people have sex in the bed, and it’s so 

Todd: gross!

It’s so gross, but it’s also hilarious. Again, I love the balance. This movie, you know, just when it’s getting intense, is throwing kind of a joke. At us like kind of a funny scene. I just love it. Yeah, so she’s under the bed She can hardly move because this thing is is coming to coming right down on her But she tries to sneak out and she does she kind of crawls across the floor Also, I have to say like The sex scene, once again, brought back a little bit of, I don’t know, is it right for me to say tenderness, because you know these people are monsters, right, by what they’re actually doing, but she sits down and she says to him, she says, tell me, I’m special.

Yeah. And he says, of course you are. You’re the most beautiful woman I’ve ever seen. Tell me I’m yours, that you still want me. And he starts feeling on her breasts and taking her shirt off. And he’s like, what if my heart can’t take it? But, but they do it. I don’t know, I, again, uh, not to get too philosophical, but, you know.

Old people have 

Craig: sex, too. I know, and when I’m, when I’m super, super old, I’ll probably think it’s less gross. I hope so, anyway. I know. Uh, yeah, whatever. All right, so they do it. Gross. All right, um… 

Todd: She makes it out. She should have grabbed the shotgun, but she didn’t. 

Craig: Like, the old woman also talks about, like, he asks her…

If, uh, Bobby Lynn, she’s like, you know, I fed it to the alligator or whatever, she’s like, was she the one? She’s like, no, I don’t like blondes. I like that other one, she’s… Like me. She’s talking about, um, Maxine. She’s, uh, that one has something special, like I did. Now, I’ve, I’ve, I’ve read a bunch of stuff about this in almost every movie that, or almost everything that I’ve read says that the title is a reference to the X rating, which I’m sure that it is, you know, the, when Especially when porn, you know, started becoming more mass marketed, then that’s where the X rating came from.

There’s a whole history there that you can read about. It’s kind of boring. But I understand that that’s, um, where the title draws its inspiration from. But I also think that it’s not just that. You’re 

Todd: thinking X chromosome? 

Craig: No, no, the, the… The producer, whatever his name was, said to Maxine several times, You’ve got that thing, you’ve got that something special, you’ve got that X factor.

It’s gotta be intentional. This old lady sees something special in Maxine. I don’t think that it’s any coincidence that Maxine has the letter X. in it. Um, there’s something special about her, which I will be really interested to see if it is explored further in the sequel, which hasn’t come out yet, but I’m excited about it.

We’ll talk about it later. So, but anyway, she crawls out, Maxine crawls out, she runs for the van, but the tires are slashed and the keys aren’t in it, but she does get a gun out of the glove box. 

Todd: And if you’ve been paying attention, you already know this gun is not loaded. Right. Because, earlier in the movie, when the old man threatened, uh, Wayne with his shotgun, and eventually put it away, and Wayne was like, oh, you really scared me.

The old man said, well, it’s not loaded anyway, just brandishing it is enough to pretty much do the job. And Wayne said, oh yeah, I understand, I’ve got the same thing with a gun in my glove box. 

Craig: Right, right, right. So she, Maxine lets Lorraine out of the basement, and Lorraine is freaking out, and she runs out the door and Howard shoots her.

Uh, in the head, in the face. 

Todd: She flops down, again, happens so fast. To a girl that I thought was going to be, I didn’t think she was going to be a final, the final girl, but I sure thought she was going to last until the end. That one caught me 

Craig: off guard. I didn’t, I didn’t think that she was going to make it, but.

The, yeah, I, it caught me off guard. She’s dead. And then, um, but Howard and Pearl, he finally calls her Pearl at this point, up until now. She hasn’t had a name. But Howard and Pearl are talking and they’re talking about how, you know, they’ve got to stage it so it looks like it was, um, self defense in case the police come.

Pearl doesn’t even think that the police will come. She doesn’t think anybody will even know these people are missing. They’re dragging the body in. They’re dragging the body in. Maxine pops out with the gun. And, it’s, I mean, this, this is so funny, like, does she try to shoot them? That, I, the way that Howard dies is hilarious 

Todd: to me.

Yeah, he just has a heart attack. 

Craig: Because, Lor, they’re dragging Lorraine’s body in, but she’s not quite dead, so she like, flops, and that scares him, and he has a heart attack, and drops. Dead. Ugh. So funny. And then, uh, Maxine exposes herself and Pearl is like, you have to help him, he’s having a heart attack.

Like, like I care, crazy lady. Maxine pulls the trigger on her gun, but it’s empty. Pearl picks up the shotgun. Which is loaded, and fires at Maxine. Misses, because Maxine dodges behind, but the kick of it launches her out the door 

Todd: and off the porch. It backfires, basically, yeah. And at the same time, that screen of the preacher on television, which we have been seeing constantly throughout all of this, says Now that’s what I call divine intervention.

Ha Ha Ha Ha Ha Ha Ha Ha. That’s funny. And then Maxine walks outside, the old woman is still alive, but she’s on the ground, and she’s complaining about her hip. Ha Ha Ha Ha 

Craig: Ha Ha. Oh god, I love this. Right. But then when um, Maxine is obviously not going to help her. And is getting into the van. Pearl says to her, We’re the same.

You’ll end up just like me. And Maxine says, I’m nothing like you. You’re a kidnapping, murdering, sex fiend. I’m a f ing star. The whole world’s gonna know my name. I will not accept a life I do not deserve. Oh, I love that. I love that. Pearl says, You’re not special. It’ll all be taken from you just like it was for me.

I’ll tell the whole world what you are. And Maxine, behind the wheel of the van, says, It’ll be our little secret. Which is what Pearl said to her before. And now she says it, and then runs over her head with the van. I love it! Crushes her head. Yeah, does a bump, does a bump a coke. Does a bump 

Todd: a coke while she’s driving.

Drives away. 

Craig: But then, it cuts back to the TV and the televangelist, I didn’t see this coming, but, you do hear the televangelist say something like. I will not accept a life I do not deserve. You hear him say that, which we know we’ve heard Maxine say before. And then he says, the preacher’s like, I’m gonna show you something.

And he pulls a sheet off of this giant photograph. And it’s a picture of Maxine as a younger girl. And he says, this is my daughter. But she… Fell into darkness or whatever and I just hope and pray that someday she’ll be back. So all the while Maxine has been this televangelists daughter. Yeah So 

Todd: interesting.

I know but I’m not sure that was necessary. I don’t know. I I there’s a There’s a third movie, right? So Pearl is a prequel There’s a third movie called Maxine which is supposed to take place after this one. I do wonder if That will be explored more like her background because I didn’t I was really puzzled by that reveal, y’know, why was that a necessary…

Craig: I think just kinda to show where she came from, like that really kind of repressed, puritanical… 

Todd: But it’s such a… Coincidence, right? That this preacher everyone’s been watching on TV happens to be her dad. 

Craig: Right. And, and obviously, you know, she knows that, but she never, there’s never any indication that she says anything.

No. Um, I, I will be interested to see if it’s explored in the sequel too, but I think that this movie was intended. Now, of course, I don’t know. I, I, you know, I’d call up Ty West if I couldn’t ask him. I don’t know. But, I, I think that this movie was intended to just be a one off. Mm hmm. And then, they, they had to quarantine in order to be able to film it.

While in quarantine, Ty West and Mia Goth were just talking and exploring The old lady’s backstory because Mia Goth was going to be playing the old lady They were just exploring her backstory and they got so involved with it that that backstory Became a script and Ty West asked Mia Goth, you know when we’re done filming this movie.

Do you want to hang around? I don’t remember where they filmed. I want to say like New Zealand or something. Do you want to hang around and film? This prequel, and she was like, absolutely. So I have no idea if a sequel was ever intended. Right. And so I don’t know how much of it will tie in. Because the, the, the prequel wasn’t intended.

It just spontaneously happened. And it’s fantastic! And I can’t wait to talk about it! It’s so good. I can’t wait 

Todd: either, I haven’t seen it yet. 

Craig: Well, I would say, I would say, and, and, We’ll see whether or not you agree with me. I would say… That the, that Pearl is better than this movie. And I read a critique that said that Pearl inadvertently makes this movie better.

Because when you know the backstory, it adds. So much context to this movie. 

Todd: Interesting. 

Craig: It’s, it’s so good and I’m so excited to talk about it. The real quick at the, it cuts back, uh, the movie. Yes. Then it bookends itself. We get, you know, the cops at the scene as we saw in the very beginning, and they’re looking around, they have no idea what’s going on.

Um, but one of them finds a camera and , one of the deputies says, what do you think’s on it? And the sheriff says, well, By the looks of everything, I’d say one goddamn f ed up horror picture. Boom! Cut to credits. Like, oh! So clever! I love it! I love it, love it, love it. Ty West just, you know. Giving himself a little pat on the back there, right at the end.

I’d say one Goddamn f ed up horror picture. 

Todd: Ha ha ha ha! Oh man. I just, I can’t fault this movie at all. I just, I thought it was great every minute of it. It was so intriguing. The pacing was so good. The filmmaking, just so good. The characters and the acting, so good. The story had me the whole time. Even though it, it’s not that fresh, I guess.

I mean, at its core. But boy, there were enough elements to freshen this up. And yet it still called back to those 70s horror movies that I liked, without making a big deal out of it. It’s just very understated in moments, and in other places just… very obvious, you know what he was doing. And I just thought it was great.

I just thought the balance was fantastic. I’m so happy to see it. And you’ve raised my expectations for Pearl because the whole reason we’re doing this movie now is so that we can do Pearl next week. No, 

Craig: because I watched it and I will obviously talk about it in depth next week. But I watched it and was just blown away.

I like this movie. Yeah. A lot. If you couldn’t tell, you know, based on the fact that we’ve been talking about it for an hour and a half. I like this movie a lot. It’s been on our radar for a really, really long time. Um, we just hadn’t gotten around to it. And then, a couple of weeks ago, I saw Pearl, and I texted you, I’m like, That is the best movie that I’ve seen in a long time.

Not the best horror movie alone, the best movie I’ve seen in a long time. That’s high praise. It is. And I think that just even going back to this movie, I just think that Ty West is really, really talented. Um, I think he’s a really good filmmaker and a good storyteller. He wrote this movie and he wrote Pearl.

That, that really impresses me because You know, there, there are really talented directors out there. There are really talented writers out there. There aren’t a lot of people who can do both. So skillfully and, and to be so good in, in both capacities is rare and impressive. I can’t wait to talk about Pearl with you next week.

And I Anything that this guy puts out, I’m gonna take a look at, because he hasn’t disappointed me yet. Same here. 

Todd: Well, thank you again for listening to this episode. If you enjoyed it, please share it with a friend. Please let us know what you thought of X, if you’ve seen Pearl. No spoilers, though, because I haven’t seen it yet.

Just drop us a line on any one of our online homes. We have a Facebook page, we have a… Twitter feed, we have Instagram, uh, just Google Two Guys in a Chainsaw podcast. Also we have a Patreon, patreon. com slash chainsaw podcast. Please consider supporting us on the show and you’ll get some behind the scenes access and help us select movies, access to our minisodes, interview with us, and help us select what we’re going to do in the future.

Until next time, I’m Todd. And I’m Craig. With Two Guys and a Chainsaw.

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